Bedtime in Alaska – Open Thread
What a day. Debate number one is behind us. My take? A tie = Obama won. He’s only going to get better from here. What fun chatting with, and watching the chat of hundreds upon hundreds of Mudflatters! Almost overwhelming! My living room has never been so full.
Have fun night shift, and those of you from other continents!
First!
Did someone say that Sarah can’t be sacked; she has to agree to go?
Would love to see her want list.
Thing is, who can McCain get? Anyone worth anything will have already started running for the hills
Bit like being asked to sign on as first mate of the Titanic and knowing what comes next
It was a great day all in all. I didn’t get to have a debate party as I planned last week. To many people were either busy or unsure if the debate would even happen. I was very sure it would. Even McLame wasn’t dumb enough not to show up after the stunt he pulled yesterday. And hey, he’d already bought the ads that said he’d won.
She is in waaaaay over her head. I hope she really does put the country first and just bow out gracefully. I even promise to be nice to her if she decides to do that. No hard feelings, really!
BTW, loved watching the debate and chatting over on SK and Teach’s site. All of you were cracking me up! I loved it! Viva la C.H.A.O.S.!!!
Go Obama-Biden ’08
Just one question for the new blog builder. I love the new edit feature, but 10min lag time is a bit long. Is there anyway to shorten it? I just can’t stay up all night to see if there is an answering comment.
I suppose I could go to bed and answer in the morning. But then I’d be awake all night wondering if I’d left someone hanging…lol.
Ok, I’m not that important….just a curious granny….that is also a night owl.
She probably will put country first and bow out gracefully… if they make it worth her while.
Time is getting tight though.
I wonder if the sticking point is that she wants immunity in AK and they can’t deliver.
” ‘You’ll see what you can do’ isn’t good enough.”
Hey AKM – What’s with the long url next to my name?
And I agree. I like the edit feature, but the 10 minute lag is a lot. Can you just add a ‘final’ click and save feature instead?
BTW…I can’t wait to hear about the rally tomorrow!!!
I see over on Huffpo that the need to further lower expectations for Sarah is the reason behind “Drill baby. Drill!”
Or, that it is the reason why, even though they are in a hole, they have to keep digging.
So many gags, so little time!
My take on the debate btw is that McCain barely pulled off a draw if he did that.
Since debating is supposed to be his thing and since tonight was supposed to be his subject, he did… poorly.
Take on the debate (by voters who watched at CNN) is that 61% say Obama won.
That’s huge, really, because this was supposed to be McCain’s game.
I thought Obama missed opportunities, like: When McCain said “it’s hard to reach across the aisle when you’re so far to the left of it” Obama gave a little laugh, but he could have said something like: “It’s hard to reach across the aisle when you won’t look across the aisle.”
GJ in Idaho. You don’t have to wait out the 10 minutes before you go ahead and make a new comment. There are still 8 minutes 45 seconds left on my last comment as I type this, and I’m going to submit it. Then I’ll be able to see what happens, and edit this comment!
I’ve still got 7 minutes to edit the other comment, but here I am merrily editing this one. “cancel” means you want to cancel the changes you made, not that you want to cancel the comment. (But if you want to erase the comment you could do that, and then “save” the blank comment). “save” means you want to save your changes.
I don’t think you need to wait for comments. You can just read the thread whenever you want to, just like we used to. If you’re new you might want to read comment threads on some old posts, and see how people respond to each other, sometimes hours later.
If I’m wrong about any of this I’m sure AKM or Snoskred will set me straight.
)
Sarah Go Home Protest in PA!! Watch the video here. It is awesome!!! So many people outside the bar where she was watching the debate. I hope this inspires you guys. Have a great rally tomorrow!
http://www.wgrz.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=60983&provider=gnews
Epic, et al: I’m pretty sure she can’t be kicked off the ticket, because she’s been officially nominated by the party.
Not even sure how they would get another person approved if she dropped off the ticket. I suppose they’d have to have a meeting of the Republican National Committee, but maybe they could do that by email vote of the committee.
The thing is, I doubt she would drop off until after the debate, which is just five days from now!
I’m just thinking what a good thing it is that this is the weekend. Not as many talking heads changing people’s minds about Barack winning. But next Friday will be interesting, after SP’s debate.
Reading adn.com this morning about the subpoenas. I wonder how many officials are going to start to realize that SP is not going to be ruling Alaska from Washington in January, but that she’s going to be fighting her own battles from Juneau, with diminished power. Not pretty for anyone. But I think if I were in that situation I’d want to call up Branchflower and say I’d reconsidered.
(no one else awake on the east coast?)
On the “McCain doesn’t look at Obama during debate” thing, I’m afraid we need a certified psychiatrist to determine why (perhaps even a panel of).
I’m certainly not going to touch that with a ten foot pole. I’m a physicist – I know my limitations.
It’s the ‘pick a point in the audience and speak to that’ technique.
Also there’s the ‘ listen to the wire and remember your talking points and hold on to your temper and… and… need to cut down on the imputs!! ‘ thing.
And I don’t see why you should know your limitations. Sarah doesn’t and look where it got her… oh, wait.
Two Good Reasons For Not Electing John McCain:
1)Elect John McCain as the 44th POTUS, and make Palin the 45th!
2)McCain offers a Third Term of Bush!
Lemonfair – you’re spot on.
The 10 minutes is for *you* to edit your post. People can reply to your comments as soon as you post them.
C aka FilterSkatePalin
Not sure why some people are getting a lot of stuff after their name. I wish I could work out why it is happening. I’m just editing it out where I see it, when I see it. It seems to have something to do with Gravatar. I have a lot of areas of expertise and Gravatar is not one of them – Sephy is the Gravatar expert, so I hope he can figure it out, but it will be a few hours before he is back online. He’s having a much deserved sleep after a long day of volunteering and then coming online to moderate the live chat..
And I’m very thankful that Sephy knows so much about Gravatars or else we wouldn’t have the snowflakes! ;(
I’m gonna catch some zzz’s myself soon
so be good ya’all!
G’Morning Mudflatters! I wish for nothing but clear skies and warm camaraderie at the rally today. Can’t wait to hear about it!
Chicago- interesting to see how other cities are covering Palin’s stay in Philadelphia. Here’s another clip from a Phila. news station.
I’ll give her this much, she is a quick study for trivial things. She even blurted *City of Brotherly Love* into the mike while wearing a Phillies jacket and a Flyers hat. What a barracuda!
http://cbs3.com/politics (film clips to the right).
It appears that more peeps lined the streets than the 400 invited to join her at the pub. I wonder if that invite was advertised as open bar?
BTW, polls taken for that same station had Obama at a 67% win for the debate.
I also wanted to add that I hope that Sarah stays holed up in the hotel for the weekend. Heavens knows that she needs that time to cram (and more) but more importantly traffic in Philly is a bear as it is without her creating more traffic jams (not to mention the 3 sporting events today).
AKA: Trough Gutted Palin
East Coast here– I’ve always had a strong feeling that SP would try to back out of the VP debate using one of her kids as a ploy–that way, her supporters (and yes, there are STILL some I’ve run across in PA, even with the Couric travesty) would go on and on and on about what a wonderful, concerned “mooom” she is, and she has their sympathy. Biden was on KO last night–very engaging; mentioned a few times that he felt that Americans were smart (obviously a nod to us who feel that the Repugs were hoping voters wouldn’t see past SP’s trendy glasses and Barbie duds) and that he wouldn’t treat her with kid gloves.
I don’t know how many out there in the Mudflats are familiar with the Tide Detergent ad showing a guy at a job interview with a large stain on his shirt. The stain is babbling incoherently while he’s trying to present himself to the interviewer. I’ve decided that Sarah needs a talking stain for the debate should she show up . . . it probably would make more sense than she does!
If the McPain campaign does opt to dump SarahDearest by the roadside, I’m betting he picks Leiberman, or possibly even Guiliani. My reasoning for Rudy (from the GOP POV) would be: 9-11; “America’s Mayor”; 9-11; he’s SUCH a “fun guy,”; 9-11 . . . Rudy suddenly took some time out from circling the remains of the country’s financial mess like a vulture and was opining on NBC, I think, after the debate last night. Guiliani does have a pro-choice stance if I remember correctly, but I think McPain is misogynistic enough to override that little character flaw. As Rachel Maddow says, talk me down . . .
I caught the last half of the debate online over here … intermittently. Ironic that I lived in the most thoroughly-wired country in Asia, but the streaming video still can’t make it live for more than 5 min. at a stretch. Arrrrgh …
My verdict: draw, advantage Obama. But a draw still, because he didn’t take the WIDE-OPEN SHOTS that McCain handed him.
Scream-aloud example: toward the end, when Ol’ John started playing his Veterans tape-loop: “I know the veterans, they know me, they know I’ll take care of them” yadda yadda yadda … I immediately screamed “GI BILL!!! Take it HOME, B.O.!” But he didn’t … let it slide … sigh.
That said, Obama was MUCH steadier and fact-equipped, and I REALLY got tired of McC’s continual patronizing tone. I’m amazed he managed to get through the whole 90 min. w/o once saying “Boy” … pompous old fart. And to think I actually used to respect that man.
Good Morning Mudpuppies!
Obama will make an excellent Commander in Chief!
He is highly intelligent: very knowledgeable; confidant; calm under pressure; has a great temperament; he will be a peace maker not a war monger; he as the ability to transcend the divisions within our own country; when facing a crisis he looks at the facts and assess’ the entire situation before drawing conclusions…unlike McCain; He can look the enemy directly in his eye and speak the truth to his face(last night that was John McCain).
Over the past several months, I’ve concluded that the greatest difference (in my humble opinion) between Obama and McCain is this: Barak Obama has a Moral Compass. It is not something you can learn, it is something you are born with. You either have it or you don’t. And if you do have it, is the that trait to which you strive to live your entire life by. It is the force that directs your path in life. Barak Obama has a Moral Compass…. McCain does not. Just my personal assessment.
One of my favorite moments in the debate is when Obama looked McCain in the eye and told him that the War in Iraq didn’t just begin in 2007 with the Surge. The war in Iraq began in 2003, and McCain was wrong about the war, and he was wrong about the WMD’s, and too many lives were lost because of it!
Go Obama / Biden 2008
AKA: Trough Gutted Palin
Husband just heard on WINS (NYC radio news station) that the conservative Repub base is calling for McPain to pull the plug on SP, stating that her speaking skills/knowledge are/is so painful. I guess this has escalated–husband is betting on Leiberman . . .
BTW, just heard that SP is in PA–we’re heading down there now. Time for a side trip to Philly? “Honest, officer, I thought I was hitting the brake pedal!”
Good Morning Mudpuppies!
Obama will make an excellent Commander in Chief!
He is highly intelligent: very knowledgeable; confidant; calm under pressure; has a great temperament; he will be a peace maker not a war monger; he has the ability to transcend the divisions within our own country; when facing a crisis he looks at the facts and assesses the entire situation before drawing conclusions…unlike McCain; He can look the enemy directly in his eye and speak the truth to his face (last night that was John McCain).
Over the past several months, I have concluded that the greatest difference (in my opinion) between Obama and McCain is this: Barak Obama has a Moral Compass. It is not something you can learn, it is something you are born with. Either you have it or you don’t. And if you do have it, is the trait to which you strive to live your entire life by. It is the driving force that directs your path in life. Barak Obama has a Moral Compass…. McCain does not. Just my personal assessment.
One of my favorite moments in the debate is when Obama looked McCain in the eye and told him that the War in Iraq didn’t just begin in 2007 with the Surge. The war in Iraq began in 2003, and McCain was wrong about the war, and he was wrong about the WMD’s, and too many lives were lost because of it!
Go Obama / Biden 2008
Sarah Palin pulling out? I don’t think it’ll happen. For two reasons – no, three, really:
1) John McCain. The old man has always been a temperamental and stubborn cuss, and like most old men who are used to having their way, age has only further calcified his “oops” meter. I just don’t see J-Mac admitting to such an awesomely chowderheaded mistake this late in the game.
2) Miss Wasilla herself. Ambition and ego such as hers acknowledge no limits. If making a fool of yourself with Katie Couric doesn’t humble you, nothing short of God Himself will. (And even HE would probably give up and throw you out after your third rotation through purgatory.)
3) Theater. They’re onstage now, the audience is watching, the machinery is in motion. Nothing for it but to play the whole farce out to its pathetic end.
(hey, I can mix metaphors with the best of them! …) ;-D
MJC (03:50:57) :
One of my favorite moments in the debate is when Obama looked McCain in the eye and told him that the War in Iraq didn’t just begin in 2007 with the Surge. The war in Iraq began in 2003, and McCain was wrong about the war, and he was wrong about the WMD’s, and too many lives were lost because of it!
_________________________________________
Remarks at Crooks and Liars about this point in the debate, with actual quotes from Obama’s speeches. Refutes the Repub. spin put on Obama’s statements.
http://www.crooksandliars.com/
Presidential Debate: Obama Calls Out McCain’s Judgment
http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/09/26/presidential-debate-obama-calls-out-mccains-judgment/
McCain can’t remove Sarah from the ticket. Thomas Eagleton removed himself from McGovern’s ticket in 1972. I don’t know if it mattered or not…Nixon was considered “unbeatable” that year. Also, Eagleton removed himself after only a few days, not less than 6 weeks before the general election. I think McCain is stuck with his decision. If she DOES have the humility and foresight to remove herself (which, if she is sucking up the attention in Philadelphia she likely doesn’t) it might be just as bad for McCain.
ETA: The Eagleton situation is sad, really. But I still believe that, unfortunately, being treated for depression would still rule someone out from a Presidential campaign. Being 72 and having cancer 3 times doesn’t, but being treated for a common mental illness would.
I want her to stay, if only for entertainment value on Thursday. And if I knew Obama-Biden would win.
One sick old mudpuppy checking in here who could not stay awake to see the debate and can barely see the screen to type.
Don’t have the energy to read all the comments or the newspaper – did our man do well?
*waves* from Australia
I cannot understand why people would consider voting for such an old man. I am not being ageist either, there is old and there is old. It is a fact that he has had huge mental strain (POW) in his life and he has had cancer. Some have mentioned he could be in early stages of dimentia. I have heard that dimentia can develope quite quickly. I think it is obvious he gets flustered and is not the fittest around. This is a huge 24/7 x 52 job for four years !
He may be OK for one or two but imagine (horror) if he got in and was around for 8 years….until he was 80….
Whereas Obama is young and fit and healthy. He is a class act, smart and up to date in this ‘modern’ society, computers et al.
Surely you want to ‘invest ‘ in someone for the long haul…ie fully compos mentus for the next eight years as oposed to say only the next 3 ? And then…..? I shudder to even think about it so close to my bedtime…
I really do think Mr Mccain is past his used by date in fully active ‘president-potential’ service.
It is time to pass the torch onto the next generation. This is Mr Obama’s time.
Derek et al:
Other reasons she won’t pull out:
McCain would tick off the evangelical base, without picking up anybody.
Lieberman is probably the only person who would take the position (it has to be somebody who is reasonably vetted) and this would outrage McCain’s conservative and evangelical bases.
He’s in a box. Palin pleased all of his base, and now the conservatives see the writing on the wall and will want something different from what the evangelical base wants (because they still want Palin).
The problem with trying to replace her is that McCain can only nominate a replacement – then the party has to approve the nomination at a special convention. This is what the Democrats had to do to replace Eaagleton with Sergeant Shriver in 1972. It would be interesting to see, because it woild also open the question of perhaps getting a new presidential nominee. I’m sure there are a number of GOP members fantasizing about that, particularly, Romney, Giuliani and Huckabbe.
Steph aka Beans Harpoon PalinNo Gravatar (04:02:20) :
I want her to stay, if only for entertainment value on Thursday. And if I knew Obama-Biden would win.
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Exactly! As Frank Zappa used to remind us, back in the 80′s: “Politics is the entertainment branch of industry.”
Although since then, I’ve come to prefer another theory … the one about DC being Hollywood for ugly people.
After reflecting on the debate last night and asking my 30 something children and my 20 something children and their friends what they felt about it? We all came to the same conclusion.
John McCain is still living in the past.
The children said they felt like they were getting a lecture from Grandpa and he kept telling his old war stories.
I felt that he has not stopped fighting the communists and he is determined to drag us back in time to keep fighting that old fight.
Conclusion all the way around was, we need to move forward and look to the future.
I also want to comment about the lack of eye contact on McCains part. I felt this was blatant disrespect to Obama and a way of McCain to hold on to his temper.
What I kept thinking was if you can’t look a fellow American in the eye how will you face world leaders that you have to confront? Very scary!
Still have the energy to hop over to the forums page and found this:
http://www.wgrz.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=60983&provider=gnews
Sarah’s reception in Philadelphia.
Chicago
THANKS for the link to Sarah’s visit to Philly – it was great and I hope the rally in Anchorage is even bettter!!
lemonfair:
My God, you mean there are still people who can distinguish between a conservative and a Republican??? Bless you, fellow mudpuppy! It was getting lonely there for a while! (Like fifteen years!)
I’ve been trying ever since Reagan’s 2nd term to get someone to explain exactly WHAT was any modern Republican trying to “conserve” … Not the Constitution, not our world standing, not our alliances, sure as hell not the Treasury … silly me, who actually checks the dictionary and foolishly thinks words MEAN something!
Susie in Jersey.
Thank You for that video footage. That was Priceless!!!
Proud Community OrganizerWA:
John McCain is still living in the past.
The children said they felt like they were getting a lecture from Grandpa and he kept telling his old war stories.
I felt that he has not stopped fighting the communists and he is determined to drag us back in time to keep fighting that old fight.
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Hee hee … you just reminded me of a choice analogy. I was in Poland, back when Sen. Obama was preparing to enter the race, and I chatted about the possibility with some students in my English classes … the older ladies couldn’t see him winning, because of people with “traditional mentality”.
“Traditional mentality” in Poland can mean anything from mere provinciality to religious fundamentalism (Catholic in their case) to outright racism. Poles will tell you they are well supplied with all of these. The stereotypical “traditional” voters are known as “moherowe berety” – the doddering old church-ladies all wearing the same style of mohair beret.
I hadn’t quite appreciated the Polish sense of humor until then!
Bonus: At that time, Poland had twin brothers (Lech and Jaroslaw Kaczynski) as President and Prime Minister, respectively … and their party’s initials are PiS. You can’t make this stuff up.
Derek Rock Crane LOL at your post.
It seems there are just as many “moherowe berety” here in America. I have two Aunts I love them dearly, but they fall into this catagory. Interestingly they are both Catholics.
Just wanted to check in quick before I leave to work in Pa today on Obama campaign…
I also LOVED that comment re the war in Iraq did not start with the surge
I have been concerned that this war has just gone underground, no one has been talking about it lately…but it goes on and on and on…as more people die, are injured, and the money is unreal (there is a site where you can actually calculate the cost of the war, down to your very own county and town)
My greatest fear is another war to distract the economic issues and to help with the economy at large.
They are calling it a tie??? but poster said here that cnn shows Obama won the debate, msn poll (I just voted) also saw Obama won…
Wishing you in Alaska a great rally today….
OBAMA 2008!!
Proud Community OrganizerWANo Gravatar (04:37:50) :
Derek Rock Crane LOL at your post.
It seems there are just as many “moherowe berety” here in America. I have two Aunts I love them dearly, but they fall into this catagory. Interestingly they are both Catholics.
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LOL … Of course! The silly thing is that I’m Catholic myself …. but as I learned to my cost, there are Catholics and there are Catholics. After all, Pat Buchanan is Catholic. (God help us all …)
Actually I wouldn’t worry about Palin’s performance during the VP debate.
Expectations are now so low as to be non-existent.
All she has to do is stand there for 90 minutes, smile, look confident, put on the moose act, actually walk off alive, and the pundissariat will be tripping over themselves with superlatives.
She’s just red-meat to the base. But she won’t win any swing voters.
It was striking to hear McCain use “verbage” like:
“have been there I have seen it”
“People know me, they know what I have done in the past 26 years”
“I fought all my life for this”
“I am proud of my record” (I love this one most, this is a gem…)
He has got a number of these nice jolly-jokers that he can insert almost anywhere, Just pick one from the list. Then repeat it many times and hope it sticks with those who do not dig the facts…. This technique is what makes his speach relatively fluid.
Obama is very intelligent, but he also needs more catch phrases for the average audience to remember.
McCain is already claiming he won. He did that Friday morning.
http://technorati.com/posts/9EbJIZLx1B2CozT4GhMTrvMDcydf_vJurgetuYqQxcg%3D?sub=xPapFCn3vP7tj6xgHpg9Nhbdd6jGXZmcd64nYhv5qrg%3D
Obama is a class act and looked very Presidential. McCain did not even look at Obama. Who the fuck does McCain think he is?
One thing that occurred to me last night while watching the debate is the realization that Palin will get slaughtered. How can a dim witted pit bull with lipstick stand up to the dog catcher Joe Biden. NOT.
Rickets Nixon Spirograph Agnew Palin formOz (04:47:23)
All she has to do is stand there for 90 minutes, smile, look confident, put on the moose act, actually walk off alive, and the pundissariat will be tripping over themselves with superlatives.
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True, but after the Katie Couric fiasco, what are the odds? Remember, she’s going up against Joe “Jaws” Biden here. That man takes no prisoners once he gets motor running.
(Granted, he DOES have a tendency to hit the nail on the head, then toss the hammer forcefully into the teeth of some innocent bystander … but I doubt that’ll cost him against Miss Wasilla.)
I also wanted to post something that was very sobering for me last night. It came up when Senator McCain held up his wrist to make a point about wearing the bracelet given to him by a Mom whose son was killed in action and then Senator Obama held up his wrist to let McCain know that he too wore one.
At the time I was somewhat amused that they were going bracelet for bracelet and I loved that Obama made my point for me that there were just as many Mothers out there who had lost children in Iraq and wanted this “war” to end.
What was sobering was my SIL was watching the debate with us and he is in the military and has served 3 tours (3 1/2 years) in Iraq as a combat medic. His quiet comment at that moment was ” I have 17 KIA bracelets” do I win?
He was not being sarcastic he looked very sad. I know that he lost his best friend in Iraq so I knew one of those bracelets was his. I asked him about the others. They were given to him by family members and friends of fellow soldiers that he had tried to save, and the ones he knew there was no saving. He always wrote those families letters to let them know that he was so very sorry that he could not medically save their loved ones but he made damn sure that they were treated with respect while they were in his hands.
He is not voting for John McCain as he feels, as many others do, that Senator McCain does not treat or show respect for him or his fellow soldiers as he has voted to many times against to many bills that would support the soldiers and their families. The final straw was McCains record on the current GI Bill.
So I feel that John McCain does not know soldiers and or Vets.
Be gentle on Palin. She needs to last another two weeks. The explosion will be bigger… And it will be really too late to replace her.
@zim
“past his use by date” — now there’s a slogan!
Derek Rock Crane: True, but after the Katie Couric fiasco, what are the odds? Remember, she’s going up against Joe “Jaws” Biden here. That man takes no prisoners once he gets motor running.
(Granted, he DOES have a tendency to hit the nail on the head, then toss the hammer forcefully into the teeth of some innocent bystander … but I doubt that’ll cost him against Miss Wasilla.)
____________________________________________________________________
Ok big belly laugh at the “hit the nail on the head, then toss the hammer forcefully into the teeth of some innocent bystander.”
That is the best description of Senator Biden. I love him but he does do this!
Moderator,
You need to have the links we provide in our posts open in a new window. Otherwise we lose your site.
Joe Biden might help her along, since she can’t grasp words like “Caricature”.
My husband is betting they will treat her like a prisoner for the next 6 days, brainwashing her to memorize answers for any possible question, complete with sound bytes and catch phrases. Then, she will just have to smile, look pretty and regurgitate.
She may even do well…Biden knows better than to underestimate Palin or the Republicans.
Does anyone know if we’ll be able to watch the Anchorage rally online today???
Proud Community OrganizerWA
…
So I feel that John McCain does not know soldiers and or Vets.
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This former Army Reservist (Ft. Lawton 1397th TTU, Seattle) firmly agrees. And kudos to your SIL … any combat medic wins by default, there being no better people on God’s earth.
I never cease to be amazed at how Repub’s natter on about the military while neglecting them and taking them (and their votes) for granted … and then foam at the mouth when called on it. I think that’ll cost the GOP *heavily* this year.
Consider Kitsap County, WA … Navy Central, heavily Republican – and keep re-electing Democrat Norm Dicks to Congress for 20-some years. Why? He knows which side his bread’s buttered on – and the Navy has no better friend.
Proud Community OrganizerWA(04:55:45) :
I wish your son-in-law could write, for publication, an opinion piece about his experiences – or even just a letter to a newspaper.
Thank you for sharing this story.
Something changed to the worse when moving to the new website:
Previously, my name above a comment was actually a link to my home page (useful, I think, for those who don’t automatically Google every name they encounter).
Not anymore, however.
Is it possible to restore this feature ? Thanks in advance.
cagoNo Gravatar (02:20:33) :
Sarah Go Home Protest in PA!! Watch the video here. It is awesome!!! So many people outside the bar where she was watching the debate. I hope this inspires you guys. Have a great rally tomorrow!
http://www.wgrz.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=60983&provider=gnews
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What a wonderful thing to see in the morning! Love the way Philly “greeted her”.
You wonderful, brave Alaskan women are not alone–be safe today, be strong today and know that we are with you!
@Chicago (02:20:33) :
Sarah Go Home Protest in PA!! Watch the video here. It is awesome!!! So many people outside the bar where she was watching the debate. I hope this inspires you guys. Have a great rally tomorrow!
http://www.wgrz.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=60983&provider=gnews
Thank you for this ….. I wonder if the people in the bar asked her any questions.
Steph aka Beans: I’m just as sure that she’ll be hammered with the essential 101′s during the next several days. Who will be moderating the VP debate? Gwen Ifill? I’m thinking that she won’t put up with any nonsense and if she encourages the candidates to speak to each other (as did Jim), Sarah will quickly stumble into her * …rinse, repeat* mode, quivering smile and all.
The article says she didn’t even stay and watch the debate at the bar – and wouldn’t say where she went . . . I wonder how much of the debate she even understood??
Way, way off topic.
Hey Aussies now on site….how about the Hawks ?…Great game !
about opening links in new sites.
Doesn’t your browser have tabbed browsing? I just open every link in a new tab, then when I am done reading mudflats I have an average of seventeen-thousand tabs open. LOL
About the seventeen bracelets…that is just sad and made me cry. Thank your SIL for his service.
There was another Strike Chipper on here, yesterday. I am the one from South Carolina–don’t want to mislead anyone.
I thought Obama was the hands-down winner, despite letting McCain get away with too much. On the other hand, I’m sure he was warned not to look like an “angry black man” for the most obvious of reasons. He was cool, dignified, handled his angry moments in a dignified and reasonably respectful manner, he answered questions with facts and did not ramble… I am amazed that anyone could believe that McSame won it!
Where are the compilation clips of McCain’s grimacing and teeth-grinding and bizarre smiles, ala the Gore-sighing clips? Silliness!
BTW full disclosure: I did not start out an Obama supporter and was only lukewarm on him–until last night.
He is the man.
Please forgive if this link was previously posted.
http://vetsforobama.org/2008/09/16/mccains-shameful-voting-record-on-vets-issues/
hey zim, I still have a stupid grin on my face… couldn’t have asked for a better game
MJCNo Gravatar (03:50:57) : Barak Obama has a Moral Compass.
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You are absolutely right! Therefore, he doesn’t go for the zinger that we all know that McCain’s comments beg.
Obama is a gentleman, an informed, thoughtful and extraordinary gentleman. He’s a leader and it shows.
Just working my way through the thread, but had to say that!
Grammy- I posted this earlier this morning (but that was then). This one is from Philly and the answer is *are you kidding me?* That was just a photo shoot!
http://cbs3.com/politics (clip to the right).
And mind you this was all going on as the Phillies were playing a nailbiting game (across town)! Kudos to all the peeps who chose to abandon their TVs/game seats to make their voice heard.
Derek Rock Crane:
“I never cease to be amazed at how Repub’s natter on about the military while neglecting them and taking them (and their votes) for granted … and then foam at the mouth when called on it. I think that’ll cost the GOP *heavily* this year.”
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I so agree with this statement! The Republicans are seriously out of touch on this issue. Though my SIL does point out to me that there are still many soldiers who will vote Republican because they will not take time to look at the issues and firmly believe they are in the soldiers corner. He is spending his time every chance he gets outside of the military base to inform fellow soldiers about McCains voting record.
Yes Norm Dicks is very intouch with his military constituents and fights for them.
Thank you for your service to our country!
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Mizkay Spackle Camshaft: I would love for him to write about his experiences, but we have a hard time even getting him to talk about them at all.
We are just giving him time to adjust and be home and not pushing the issue with him. When he shares we feel honored to listen. He finished his last tour in April, at that time he was stationed at Ft. Stewart, GA. We were absolutely thrilled when he received orders for Ft. Lewis WA. We now have my daughter our grandchildren and our SIL very close to where we live!!
Your Welcome and thank you for reading it and letting me share.
Obama looked terrific last night. Solid debate, looked presidential, in control, not flustered.
McCain looked grumpy, angry, pissed off, was condescending and very old and out of touch. And let us not forget, this was supposed to be McCain’s strongest debate. He looked terrible and he showed several times how Obama got under his skin. The fact that he would not even look at Obama needs to gain some traction. That spoke volumes about this man. He is a typical bully.
John McCain’s ” Chicken Little” approach is getting a bit tiresome. He seemed borderline hysterical, condescending & smug during the debate…..he wants to extend Bush’s politics of fear. Speaking of judgement….every move he’s made recently has been dead wrong….SP as VP…..Superman rush to Wash….trying to cope out of debating.
Oh my- my post just flew into cyberspace!
As I posted earlier, here’s another clip of Sarah’s visit to Philly.
http://cbs3.com/politics (clip at the right)
Aussie Puck Mule- the peeps that were in the Irish Pub her were *by invite only* (aka it was another photo shoot- no questions allowed).
PCOWA- your post brought tears to my eyes. 17 bracelets is 17 too many. Thank you SIL for your service.
Proud Community Organizer:
“I also want to comment about the lack of eye contact on McCains part. I felt this was blatant disrespect to Obama and a way of McCain to hold on to his temper.”
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Agreed, but I’ll go further. McCain and SWWNBN both use this tactic to marginalize Obama and Biden. For three weeks, SP couldn’t even say their names and did not do so until this week! Behavior like this offends me personally.
Further, your SIL is so right and he is not the only active military person who is voting for Obama…and retired military are very supportive of Obama.
As I posted earlier, here’s another clip of Sarah’s visit to Philly.
http://cbs3.com/politics (clip at the right)
Aussie Puck Mule- the peeps that were in the Irish Pub her were *by invite only* (aka it was another photo shoot- no questions allowed).
PCOWA- your post brought tears to my eyes. 17 bracelets is 17 too many. Thank you SIL for your service.
JoeC- “Letterman should have invited her on his show and put her in the Will-It-Float tank.” ROFLMAO
As if he didn’t have enough problems, in less than a month, Palin has transformed from being McCain’s buoy to an anchor.
The latest Daily Kos Favorable/Unfavorable poll results
CANDIDATE FAV UNFAV NO OPINION
MCCAIN 47 43 10
OBAMA 58 33 9
BIDEN 50 34 16
PALIN 41 49 10
Letterman should have invited her on his show and put her in the Will-It-Float tank.
@Joe C (06:01:48) :
Letterman should have invited her on his show and put her in the Will-It-Float tank.
Enjoyed reading the chat last night, we had a neighbor get a band to play in her yard so we were back and forth between the debate and that, then listening to the debate with ‘Born in the Bayou’ playing, which was odd because my neighborhood is pretty Repub, but is changing. Funny juxtapositions.
I thought the debate was full of unnecessary testosterone on McCain’s part, and almost the incarnation of generational change. The two candidates really represent that yin-yang thing to me, with John McCain the combative male/yang energy and Obama the more global, thoughtful, steel in a velvet glove yin/female energy. And I don’t mean that in a ‘girly-man’ way at all. As we know, walking the walk in this dangerous global village requires a lot of finesse and a willingness to dialogue, not just occupy countries or bomb them.
I also really felt that by the way he spoke, Obama has already made that mental executive transition to thinking of ‘all the people,’ and how we want our country to be in the future, and McCain is still stuck in the details of how to get his opponent and the Dems. Good executives look at the whole company, look at everyone’s talents, and help them meet the company’s objectives. Obama sounded much more like that person.
If you go the WSJ there are many comments saying Obama is untested and therefore unfit to lead. How anyone could cling to the Republican party after the economic debacle (and McCain’s bizarre attempts to derail a solution) of the past 2 weeks is beyond me, but there they are. Overall on the WSJ web site the poll states that Obama won, though.
I wanted them to discuss just what the economic impact of the bailout will be. I think Obama’s ideas are clear, to have a functional, transparent government that spends its money on worthy projects and programs that advance our goals. In the past 8-30 years, no one has really articulated those goals. So I think Obama was reluctant to say how the bailout would affect things without looking at other areas, notably defense spending, where corruption has been rampant and there could be cost savings that offset the bailout without compromising a future administration’s agenda.
I hope we see more of this in the next debate but I think both candidates find it hard to comment when the deal hasn’t been reached. Make no mistake, it is another attempt by the right/corporate elite to use ‘shock doctrine capitalism’ to run our government into the ground, and the left/Dems have enabled it to some degree, obviously particularly in the financial sector.
We so desperately need a leader who will change this culture in Washington and get us moving forward on things like green tech that will bolster our economy and maybe rework the bailout in a few years, much as Sweden did in 1992. Sorry, but I don’t have the impression John McCain is that person.
Will Palin leave the race? I don’t think so at this point, unless there is a disastrous debate performance next week (and that might well happen, that’s a lot of time on stage). If she were to pull out now, McCain’s camp would look even more flaky than they already do. Biden is a gentleman and a practiced speaker, and he will save the situation, regardless. But either the debate will result in a general call for her replacement or the McCain camp will stay with her.
Here’s Thomas Frank on the economic debacle, ‘No Future for You.’ And yet all McCain could say was Reagan, Reagan, Reagan last night. If you read his books, Obama’s own world view has more true conservative principles than the Republican party.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/thomas-frank/no-future-for-you_b_129619.html
Cassie Jeep Pike:
Agreed, but I’ll go further. McCain and SWWNBN both use this tactic to marginalize Obama and Biden. For three weeks, SP couldn’t even say their names and did not do so until this week! Behavior like this offends me personally.
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This behavior offends me also, and you are right about trying to marginalize Obama and Biden.
In the case of SP, could it be that she just learned how to pronounce their names correctly in the last 3 weeks?
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Thank you all for letting me ramble this morning and giving me a few belly laughs! I must go and start my day. I will be checking back later to see how our Alaskan friends fare at their rally today!
Totally off topic. But sitting and thinking of my friend who contacted me last week out of Galveston on a laptop rigged to a car battery. With one house left and hundreds gone, I wonder if the republican’s are figuring out how to disenfranchise these voters yet since they now have no addresses.
McCain threw in a zinger last night (I forget the exact words) indicating that he still had the utmost confidence in his choice for VP. I think he’ll be doing more of the same in the next several days as she hides in hotels and gets programmed in preparation for the event. OR JUST MAYBE she’s MIA because she’s being implanted with an audio device.
There are plenty of active duty military over here (Korea) as well, and I wouldn’t call this a safe GOP district! (granted, I don’t live in Seoul anymore, so I don’t talk to as many.)
Confession: It’s sad to recall that I actually voted for McCain once. In the 2000 primary. I lived in Kitsap at the time (Port Orchard) and just before the primary, he came out and gave a hell of a good speech on the Bremerton docks, right next to PSNS. It went over beautifully and he carried Kitsap County. (for all the good it did him!)
How the mighty have fallen …
(btw, Proud Community OrganizerWA, thanks for the compliment; but I just barely count. That was a LONG time ago and I made a pretty indifferent weekend warrior. Guys like me were just cargo-counters who wore camo once a month. Guys like your SIL are the real deal. Nice of you, though.)
GREAT night for Obama! McCain couldn’t/wouldn’t even look Obama in the eye, and for whatever reason it reflected badly on him. As usual, he gave the impression of debating himself!
I wish McCain hadn’t gotten away with his assertion that he “love(s) the Vets and the Vets know I (he) will always take care of them”, when in reality he has voted against nearly every Vet’s benefit to come down the pike. I work with Vet’s medical records and I know what they go through. McCain is such a fraud on this issue!
It’s all costing from here on out for Obama, as long as he can keep stating his credentials for being on the side of the working man/woman.
Now, onto next Thursday and the VP debate! I wonder if they will put it into multiple choice format for our dear Caribou Barbie?!?
Please don’t feel that you were wrong in supporting McCain in 2000. I firmly believe that he still had some substance then and even a backbone. Today, however, he stands for nothing.
SP cannot be allowed to drop out. She must take her rightful place as the iceberg for McCain’s Titanic.
@derek rock crane 4:55:29
“Granted, he DOES have a tendency to hit the nail on the head, then toss the hammer forcefully into the teeth of some innocent bystander ”
This is hysterically funny–by far my favorite Mudflats soundbite so far! Thank you!
SillyWhabbit
Totally off topic. But sitting and thinking of my friend who contacted me last week out of Galveston on a laptop rigged to a car battery. With one house left and hundreds gone, I wonder if the republican’s are figuring out how to disenfranchise these voters yet since they now have no addresses.
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BET ON IT!!!
SP appeared at the Repub Convention full of confidence and fired up….then…what happened ? She has now become a dithering idiot.
I have just watched a couple of her interviews…(ewwww that voice…!)
‘The Repubs have rewired her and she has lost it….I really hope this is not part of their plan to garner the sympathy vote.
The mother/sista in me….(and probably the anti cruelty animal crusader) says …
I hate to see an animal suffer, human or otherwise. (Even though she herself has been cruel)
The Repubs have used her like a bachelor party stripper and are now destroying her and I find it really sad. (in a weird sort of way)
Does anyone else feel just a little bit sorry for SP, even tho she is hateful ?
ohnWNo Gravatar (06:19:57) :
SP cannot be allowed to drop out. She must take her rightful place as the iceberg for McCain’s Titanic.
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Thank you for that “picture”…it reminded me of elementary school plays
Cassie Jeep Pike (newly a Trout, too!)
Please don’t feel that you were wrong in supporting McCain in 2000. I firmly believe that he still had some substance then and even a backbone. Today, however, he stands for nothing.
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I’d like to think that was the case … and maybe it was … Then. Seeing him now, though, I can’t help but wonder if I was really paying close enough attention. I imagine I’ve got plenty of company.
Then too, I also vastly underestimated what sort of disaster Bush would end up being … but who didn’t?
Moot point in the end, as I voted for Libertarian Harry Browne that year.
Zim– In time, maybe I’ll feel sorry for her. Right now, though, she just keeps spinning out of control and no one seems able or willing to stop her.
She should have known better, but having made the choice, she has stubbornly stuck with it.
If, by age 44, she knows no more of the world than she seems to, I think she never will regardless of the credentials of those who attempt to teach her.
JohnWNo
SP cannot be allowed to drop out. She must take her rightful place as the iceberg for McCain’s Titanic.
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LOLPFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFTTTTTTTTTTT …… (Coke spraying across keyboard…)
Boy, we mudpuppies are keeping the Metaphor Police HOPPING tonight, aren’t we?
Mudflat dreams – November Surprise…… Alaska!
Picture this: its election night and you are anxiously watching the returns. Uh – bad news, the Maverick captures his home away from home and wins New Hampshire. Bulls-eye – Obama’s work in Virginia pays off and he is the first democrat since Johnson to capture the commonwealth. No other surprises on the East coast or Midwest. McCain wins in Ohio and Indiana, Obama carries Pennsylvania, Michigan Minnesota, Wisconsin and Iowa. McCain sweeps the rest of the South and the bitters in the Appalachian states. As Obama supporters we are disappointed that you did win Florida or Ohio, but we are still looking ok.
As the night get’s later, things take a drastic turn for the worse. As expected, McCain wins all the Great Plains’ states. Obama easily wins California, Oregon and Washington. First piece of real bad news, Colorado swings to McCain. Even worse, New Mexico and Nevada are very close, but are trending towards McCain (Damn you Bill Richardson, you said we would carry New Mexico!) You don’t know whether to get another glass of wine or jump off your roof when you hear that although the results are not official, it looks like McCain is going to carry both states.
But wait, we are receiving strange votes from Alaska Charleee! The early reports are showing Obama doing well. 200 million Americans are now watching how Alaskans voted. McCaniacs are yelling WTF, that stupid snow bunny was supposed to rally our base AND make sure we carried Alaska. More results come in and yes, it seems that Alaska three electoral votes are going to push Obama over the top. (To see how the electoral map would look, see: http://www.moriches-bay.com/map.gif.
When trying to analyze how this happened, pundits and the political operatives in the McCain campaign realized that the missed the first fundamental rule of politics – all politics is local. More importantly they missed the fundamental rule in Alaskan politics – Alaskans are fiercely independent and after three months of being bullied by McCain lawyers they had enough and voted for Obama.
I hope the general election is not this close, but you never know. I hope Alaskans say enough tin horn politicians coming up and hijacking your investigations, spreading lies about respected public officials and disregarding your political processes. I live in New York and had to go through the Spitzer embarrassment. Can you imagine if McCain wins, then dies. The first Alaskan president would be Sarah Plain. I don’t think you want that on your conscious. Please, mobilize and vote!
Also off topic. This last commenter got me thinking: no more thefts of a Presidential race by the Repubs.
California where I live is an Obama State. If I was to vote by absentee ballot, that will free my time to volunteer and drive/fly to a “too close to call” state and help.
Where do Mudflatters think help is needed?
What kind of help?
Nite nite *off to bed*
USA… your watch. LOL… keep us safe.
Viva Obama/Biden
I agree with AKM that a tie means that Obama ‘won’, ie: has presidential stature, and put that issue to rest.
Obama is thoughtful and a bit wordy, which is better for being a president than for being a presidential debater.
SOMEONE has to point out ( are you listening Obama ? ) that McCain thinks like a soldier and not a president. He seems to revere the insight and judgment of Petraeus , and uses the term ‘tactic and strategy’ as a soldier and not a president. (The scope of military strategy is smaller than the scope of global political strategy and tactics.)
Its the generals that should be looking up to the judgment of the president, the president that has the good judgment to know what country to invade and the forthrightness to say exactly why we’re doing it.
Obama lightly touched on this when he mentioned that getting into Iraq in the first place was a strategic blunder. From a presidential global strategy point of view the surge is a tactic, not a strategy.
And how the HELL can we use ‘the surge’ in Afghanistan!!!
The surge was not just an increase in troops, it was a way to involve disenfranchised Sunnis in local security. HOW could that POSSIBLY work in Afghanistan.
McCain deserved a pounding but didn’t get it.
my $.02
kokofish: your help is needed in Nevada. It’s a “swing” state that definitely can go our way. Volunteer to drive to Reno if you’re in the north or Las Vegas if you’re in the south. Go to the Obama website for more details.
Kokofish
According to Merry Prankster, New Mexico or Nevada might need help!! And they’re fairly close to you in CA -
I’m outta here too … it’s Saturday Night in Korea and there IS drinking to be done, even if the beer does happen to be fit only for sewage treatment.
Cheers, fellow pups!
GoBama …
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/27/paul-newman-dies-at-83_n_129860.html
Paul Newman Died.
Just let me saw again how much I enjoyed the live chat during the debate. Even my husband, who thinks I have become overly obsessed with this whole election[because we can't vote] was laughing and reading along.
That said, I think Obama was stronger at the start. McCain was nervous, then a bully and condescending, even rude, averting Obama’s eyes even when they shook hands. Never trust someone who won’t look at you.
Several news analyses are claiming a tie, so edge to Obama. I couldn’t stay up to watch too much of the post-debate spin but my favorite comment of the night was when Blitzer said we would have loved to have Sarah Palin on, maybe we’ll get her soon and Anderson Cooper said “Don’t hold your breath.”
Proud Community OrganizerWANo Gravatar (04:55:45) :
I also wanted to post something that was very sobering for me last night. It came up when Senator McCain held up his wrist to make a point about wearing the bracelet …
What was sobering was my SIL was watching the debate with us and he is in the military and has served 3 tours (3 1/2 years) in Iraq as a combat medic. His quiet comment at that moment was ” I have 17 KIA bracelets” do I win?
___
Proud,
Thanks for sharing your real life story with us. I am sitting here with tears streaming down my aging hippie cheeks, just thinking about the horrors our brave young soldiers face every day, in the name of peace and Democracy. My son is an Army pilot who has made the unending Kosovo, Afghanistan, Iraq rotations. My heart hurts for beloved country.
@ BlancheMadison
Giuilani? The very same guy who’s now whoring the bailout for the failed financial corps? Why not? He’d fit in great with all of Mac’s other lobbyist buddies! And he can speak in complete intelligible sentences … noun, verb, 9/11. He’d be an improvement over SWMNBN. Sick and sad.
Can’t believe Paul Newman died, sad . . .
Kate aka chin dustrap – you and I must be in the same boat – can’t vote (yet!) but completely obsessed by this election and my husband is counting the days till this is over and I can extricate myself from my laptop!
I watched the debate with 2 repubs (I live in Tx so hard to avoid them!) and they seem to buy the fearmongering but don’t care for SP, disappointingly they don’t seem to dislike her enough to save themselves from voting the party line. I spent a goodly amount of time reminding them of McCain’s health issues and one heartbeat away….not to mention voting 90% Bush, nor the lack of health and tax records, or any other snippets I could slip in!
Avril
ChacoNo Gravatar and Grammy a/k/a Commando Coalfire Palin
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Good advice. Thanks for your motivation!
I have not been this fired up since 1968 when I was a McCarthy organizer in Northeast Los Angeles. I was 19! I went to Chicago to work at the Democratic Convention for him. Boy, I shook hands with John Kenneth Galbraith. After I told him I quit my job and drove to Chicago with friends to support McCarthy, he said “Young lady I could kiss you.” And he did — on my cheek! When I met with a delegation from the midwest, one of the Delegates said to me, “McCarthy? He needs a one-way ticket to Russia.” It was a heady, difficult and ultimately a devastating week.
Well, this is now, not then. Only now the stakes are much much higher.
Great advice. I am going to take vacation and go where it counts.
Sorry I missed watching the debate from here. We were at an Elitist Debate Wine and Cheese Party with 40 other Obamaniacs and a few independents. Was great fun and the Arugula and Roasted Pepper Pesto was a hit. I thought Obama was great. Pundits always expect him to hit harder but I admire him for trusting his own intuition on how far to press an issue.
Zim from Oz
I hate to see an animal suffer, human or otherwise… Does anyone else feel just a little bit sorry for SP, even tho she is hateful ?
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When I see SP fumbling on TV (w/ Gibson or Couric) it’s hard not to feel sorry for her. But when I see clips of her at rallies and she seems so smug, it makes me want to throw something at my laptop.
I think she’s on the ticket ’til the bitter end. Replacing her w/ Lieberman (or any of the other likely suspects) would be seen as an insult to the Evangelical base – McCain simply can’t afford to have those folks boycott the polls. I suppose a convenient “family emergency” would give her an out but even the MSM would be all over that, so it’s hard to see how faking an emergency would work.
In a perfect world, Palin would fade into obscurity and stop being such a distraction from the real issues. I want Obama to win b/c voters are finally ready to tackle the problems the country faces. With the economic mess, and the war and, etc., etc., he’s going to need an incredible base of support to get anything done. Getting elected is only the first step.
@ kokofish,
You can make calls to Nevada or New Mexico, starting now. Check out the Neighbor to Neighbor feature on the campaign website. They’re identifying potential Obama supporters to work on to make sure they vote.
kokofish palinNo Gravatar (06:36:12) : I’d say Ohio or Florida where most of the vote stealing has happened. Right now Ohio could go blue if people get in there and take voters to the polls. On the fivethirtyeight.com site: Nevada is already a light blue (barely democratic). Ohio is white. Which means it could go either way. Ohio would be my first choice.
So sad to hear about Paul Newman. But, the good old National Enquirer was the one that broke this story about his lung cancer and that he was dying. So, I knew it was coming, but still he is an icon and will be sorely missed. RIP Paul.
To all you Alaskan MudPuppies heading to the rally today. You are supported by the spirits of many of us that haven’t had the chance to show that we want truth too! So go get em, scream loud, scream for the truth! Can’t wait to get the photos from today.
Slap Spear Palin
pamela (07:18:34) : I’d feel sorrier for the country if Palin became VP!!
Check out what CNN’s Jack Cafferty thinks of silly sarah.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8__aXxXPVc&eurl=http://www.dailykos.com/
obama vs mccain. it’s telling how each campaign chose to use the debate footage to attack each other in their new ads. i’m bias, but i believe obama’s has a tighter, more relevant message
mccain: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ec3aC8ZJZTc&eurl=http://www.mydd.com/story/2008/9/27/12741/1872
obama: http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/9/27/92848/6301/452/608733
@ Zim,
If you’re still awake… at the RNC all SP had to do was read the teleprompter. As a former TV reporter, she knew how to do that. And her natural meanness let her read her lines with enthusiasm. In interviews, she has to demonstrate that she can not only read, but think and remember.
There was a great line in our newspaper mag recently. The article was about how Aldus Huxley spent time in a desolate town(?) nearby, but it fits SP nicely:
“Sometimes a near blank slate provides the perfect backdrop for imagination to thrive.”
I still can’t find it in my heart to feel sorry for her. Because I think she’s too arrogant and ambitious to realize just what she’s done to her party and potentially to the country and the world. I’m still just disgusted at what she represents and that ANYONE thought her suitable to be a heartbeat away. All I can do is work for Obama and hope that she takes McCain down with her. it is a fate richly to be deserved for both of them, and the GOP as well. They are a party unworthy of respect these days.
Interesting post on Electoral-Vote.com http://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2008/Pres/Maps/Sep27.html that says a filibuster proof Senate is concieveable (albeit a long-shot).
Wouldn’t that be the perfect ending to election night – an Obama victory and a Senate that can’t block his every move. (Well, a girl can dream, can’t she?) And if that happens, we may have Alaska to thank for keeping Ted Stevens on the ballot, only to lose to Mark Begich!
Check out http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/ Why Voters Thought Obama Won
Why was Biden on many networks for post-debate analysis – bit Palin was NOWHERE? What gives? She can’t even be let off her leash to comment benignly on post-debate chitchat?
The reason we don’t see Palin is they are establishing her MIA/POW credentials so she can have something to counter Biden with at the debate. In addition to “I can see Russia”, she can now say “I was held prisoner so i can identify with John and i can understand how much he suffered so…”
Richie – interesting McCain ad — does anyone else see the irony in how he just shows clips of Obama saying that McCain is right – and then says — Obama – is he ready to lead? — NO
I mean – if he agrees with McCain and thinks he is right on these issues – then wouldn’t that be a “good thing”? Silly me.
I’m starting to think about that whole ‘fat lady singing’ thing because so many commentators are doing “Rewind it and put it back in the box .”
We really do have to keep the pressure on right to the end.
We can’t lose this one.
Do you guys in AK have a rally today, did I hear?
I am betting Palin will not debate. The McCain camp will allow or create some kind of news or event to break from Alaska that Sarah will have to urgently attend. She will excuse herself from the debate and the campaign to take care of this news. I do not know what the news will be, personal or professional, however I do believe there will be something where she will need to leave the campaign.
@disenchanted tore– yes. the vp debate moderator is Gwen Iffil…one of my faves. You’re right. She’s not going to badger SP, but she’s surely not going to let her off the hook. Go Gwen!
@Derek Rock Crane– I too am worried about election day Republican shennanigans vis a vis the homeless hurricane victims.
by the way… can anyone help me find that post (many threads back by now) that called for attorneys (I think) to sign up as election watch dogs? thanks!!
and off topic: Paul Newman used to race from time to time at BIR (a northern Minn. racetrack a couple miles from my house). He is beloved in this burgh! RIP dear man!
Does any one realize that if McCain/Palin win in Nov. America will be one 72 year old heartbeat away from having a woman President AND Vice President?
During out debate chat I said I thought it was a draw – I was pessimistic that the press and polls would say Obama had won, just because McCain has been getting away with his stunts without really being hit very hard. I have had a difficult time with the race still being so close. Because McCain didn’t fall down on the floor and he was able to keep talking, I figured he would be declared the winner.
How thrilling to almost immediately find that the various polls and many pundits were already giving it to Obama, or going with the point AKM made — Tie = Obama win.
I found Nora Ephron’s blog on HuffPo last night – and I pretty much was going through the same thing she did. Hey – I don’t mind being wrong in this case.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/nora-ephron/ringside_b_129822.html
***SO ANGRY*** An article at TPM by Josh Marshall
Excerpts:
Here’s one comment we got from TPM Reader EO …
“As a psychotherapist and someone who treats people with anger management problems, we typically try to educate people that anger is often an emotion that masks other emotions. I think it’s significant that McCain didn’t make much, if any, eye contact because it suggests one of two things to me; he doesn’t want to make eye contact because he is prone to losing control of his emotions if he deals directly with the other person, or, his anger masks fear and the eye contact may increase or substantiate the fear.
I noticed him doing the same thing in the Republican primary debates. The perception observers are likely to have is that he is unwilling to acknowledge the opponent’s legitimacy and/or is contemptuous of the opponent.”
Another – my personal FAVORITE!
“I think people really are missing the point about McCain’s failure to look at Obama. McCain was afraid of Obama. It was really clear–look at how much McCain blinked in the first half hour. I study monkey behavior–low ranking monkeys don’t look at high ranking monkeys. In a physical, instinctive sense, Obama owned McCain tonight and I think the instant polling reflects that.”
Marshall continues:
“So McCain may have given away his status as a low-ranking monkey. I’d never even considered monkey rank.
Late Monkey Science Update: In case anyone’s wondering, I looked up TPM Reader TB’s page at the University he teaches at. And no doubt about it, he appears to be a genuine monkey scientist, or to be more specific a researcher on social cognition and behavior in primates. I’d link to his page. But readers remain anonymous, save for their initials, until they tell us otherwise.”
Bec in IL
I mean – if he agrees with McCain and thinks he is right on these issues – then wouldn’t that be a “good thing”? Silly me.
—————————————-
During the Dempcratic primaries, I think Biden had some ads that showed other candidates saying “Joe is right” or “I agree w/ Joe” – he still didn’t win. Interesting the McCain camp thinks this same approach could help McCain.
I suppose one could argue that if Obama thinks McCain is right, that shows he’s willing to listening to all sides of an issue and not reject it out of hand b/c it comes form the other party. That’s not silly – but it may be too nuanced for the true McCainiacs. It WOULD be fun to see an Obama ad that tried to make that point. You mean a president who actually THINKS and considers all sides and doesn’t just act b/c he’s certain his gut is leading him in the right direction – what a concept
bPoint
“I do believe there will be something where she will need to leave the campaign.”
Then it’s up to us to pre-empt, to prime blogland so that they’ll all be watching for it. To hammer on about it so that if it happens the hoots of derision will be deafening and, just perhaps, the McCain campaign will think better of the tactic.
bPoint – it really is — one 72 year old heartbeat away from having a bobblehead or Chatty Cathy doll being President.
Re: Do I feel even the least bit sorry for SP?
No. I believe there are consequences to our actions, and the consequences for not thinking, not blinking, and not recognizing your limitations include that you will look like a complete fool when you can’t answer even basic questions from interviewers- particularly questions you should have anticipated (come on, you really can’t come up with a better answer to the “I can see Russia from Alaska” debacle?)
I also believe that she should be made to look as incompetent as she is, and the Republicans should live with those consequences as well so that nobody ever gambles with the future of our country like this again.
ChacoNo Gravatar
Grammy a/k/a Commando Coalfire Palin
galwhohashadenough!
No Gravatar Palmdale aka Moose Roadster PalinNo Gravatar
______________________________________________________________________
Got it, did it Mudpuppies (ready for any of those states).
Looking forward to news on the AK rally today!
Hose Hotrod Palin:
I received the invitation from the Obama Campaign, so I would guess if you go to their website you can find it- it was called Counsel for Change. If you can’t find it, leave a comment and I will see if I can dig up the link.
@Epic (07:59:11)
If they know we are expecting it, they will change the plan. I think we let it happen. Although it is an ugly tactic, at least the threat of Palin in the WH is gone.
Andrew Sullivan’s Quote for the Day:
27 Sep 2008 11:30 am
“Frankly, I’ve come to think, post-Kissinger, post-Katie-Couric, that Palin’s nomination isn’t just an insult to the women (and men) of America. It’s an act of cruelty toward her as well,” – Judith Warner, NYT.
Hey Annie – I was thinking about you last night – when it was 1:30 and I still was sitting at my laptop, clicking on HuffPo, TPM, Kos, FiveThirtyEight, one more time – for the 20th time. I am really going to need that 12-step program with you. What is the first step??? This is soooooo addictive. Still in PJs here.
My dog is just staring at me – like your horse. When is this going to end?
Fired up said — I also believe that she should be made to look as incompetent as she is, and the Republicans should live with those consequences as well so that nobody ever gambles with the future of our country like this again.
____
Perfectly said. I totally agree.
There have been a lot of references to Dan Quayle, but in the end he must be pleased that he’ll be replaced (or perhaps forgotten) in the historical references to foolish choices in politics.
Cassie Jeep Pike (newly a Trout, too!) (06:29:16) :
Zim– In time, maybe I’ll feel sorry for her. Right now, though, she just keeps spinning out of control and no one seems able or willing to stop her.
She should have known better, but having made the choice, she has stubbornly stuck with it.
If, by age 44, she knows no more of the world than she seems to, I think she never will regardless of the credentials of those who attempt to teach her.
I do not have one ounce of sympathy for that woman. And can’t imagine why anyone would. She’d shoot you in the back for positive press. Her kids now I feel sorry for, but eventually they too will grow into their Paliness and lose all sympathy points.
Any idea how many were watching the debates and mudflatting at the same time? I’m interested in the count.
You all did a very nice job hosting the event. Again thanks.
Does any one realize that if McCain/Palin win in Nov. America will be one 72 year old heartbeat away from having a woman President AND Vice President?
At the same time Palin and Pelosi!
Ever seen Born Yesterday? Great flick !
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0042276/
Silly – they posted the number at the end — it should be in the archive of the chat. it was over 1,000 online, with over 400 chatting, I believe. There were times when it took a long time for a comment to post, there were so many of us posting at the same time.
I love it when comedians get in on the action, because I really do need a good laugh right now…. my 2 favorites at the moment (besides Letterman)
Sarah Silverman with her “Great Schlep” – SO GOOD!
http://www.thegreatschlep.com/site/index.html
And the quote from Chris Rock that I personally think is highly activating for anyone on the fence:
“Vote for the guy with 1 house. If the other guy loses even half his houses, he’s still living a great life. The guy with one house has everything to lose if things don’t change”. Brilliant!
Bpoint – sorry – didn’t get your point before – but give me Pelosi any day over Palin. I still think she is just a Chatty Cathy doll grown up into Caribou Barbie.
i really need for sarah to not withdraw from the race. i need her to stay and continue to embarrass mccain to the ends of the earth. every time sarah speaks she brings the question of mccain’s judgment into the forefront and mcain’s slogan of “country first” looks like the lie that it is. we need sarah to make the sunday morning talk show rounds and not to withdraw. save sarah!
Anne,
Here’s another take on what the McCain camp has does to SP – http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/09/26/has-the-mccain-campaign-broken-sarah-palin.aspx
I’m really trying not to feel sorry for her – after all, she did accept the nomination, but when I read this, it’s hard not to have some sympathy:
“She’d be so forthright and funny and charming and genuine that the whole country would fall in love with her…
Instead, she hasn’t been allowed to give them a word to hang on: no press conferences…a couple of scripted, softbally interviews, and an ongoing effort by the McCain campaign to have her vice presidential debate postponed indefinitely. The obvious implicit message…is: You’re not ready. We don’t trust you. You have no idea what you’re talking about. Don’t ever open your mouth unless you’ve cleared it with us or you might destroy the whole campaign. These are not pleasant things to hear, and Palin has presumably been hearing them (again, by implication) every day for weeks now.”
@pamela — actually, I believe acheiving a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate is entirely possible. That’s why I’m out there busting my butt for Al Franken, whom national polls show trailing Norm Coleman by a few points. But I can tell you, the race is much tighter than these polls show. For one thing, they underestimating the cell phone only vote and the vote of Republicans like my husband who are so disgusted with Coleman, no matter what they say, when those curtains are drawn will NOT vote for him. Al Franken needs everyone’s help, not just that of Minnesotans. Norm Coleman has way too much money for ads. Still, I do believe Franken will be elected. But if you have a spare green back, please send it his way (in the interest of the fillibuster-proof senate majority).
BTW– People worry that some voters who say they support Obama, will play the race card in the voting booth. I believe national statistics say this is 5% of the voting public. But, like I said above, there’s another group that will vote against their publicly voiced claims once they get into that booth. And my husband is among them. They are Republicans who feel their party has robbed them of a vote they can make in good conscience. My husband is a fiscal Republican who is moderate to left of center on social issues. He has NEVER voted democrat or third party. And he has never not voted. Where does that leave him? Certainly, he’s not alone. I would “bet the farm” that a mouse in the corner of his booth would report an Obama vote.
Still. I agree with EPIC — there’s no coasting allowed right now. The Fat Lady is far from singing. Keep up the good fight my friends.
hose hotrod palin
PS, Anne and Bec, I’d like to join you in the 12-step program
Scary.
http://dandelionsalad.wordpress.com/2008/09/24/has-sarah-palin-been-picked-as-the-titular-head-of-the-coming-police-state-by-naomi-wolf/
aka BarrelRavenPalin/O8amaRocks
Mizkay said “One of my favorite moments in the debate is when Obama looked McCain in the eye and told him that the War in Iraq didn’t just begin in 2007 with the Surge. The war in Iraq began in 2003, and McCain was wrong about the war, and he was wrong about the WMD’s, and too many lives were lost because of it!” I agree. But here’s what got me : McCain kept talking about Patraeus and using everything he ever said as proof that everything McCain has said about the war is right. But why doesn’t Obama ever bring up (and the debate would have been the PERFECT place) to Johnny the last thing Patraeus said in that he (Patraeus) would NEVER declare victory in Iraq, that the word isn’t even and never would be appropriate when talking about Iraq. And Obama should have asked McCain what he means when he keeps using the term “defeat” in Iraq.
I also agree wholeheartedly that Obama came off as so much more knowledgeable, confident, intelligent and, yes, Presidential. And didn’t you all notice how out of breath McCain was all through the debate? Scary when you think of who the #2 is!
@hose hotrod
Good to hear that Franken might actually have a chance, and I will make a donation in the spirit of a filibuster-proof Senate. I don’t know much about Minnesota politics, but I always thought Coleman winning Wellstone’s seat was a travesty.
Bec in IllinoisNo Gravatar (08:06:19) :
Hey Annie – I was thinking about you last night – when it was 1:30 and I still was sitting at my laptop, clicking on HuffPo, TPM, Kos, FiveThirtyEight, one more time – for the 20th time. I am really going to need that 12-step program with you. What is the first step??? This is soooooo addictive. Still in PJs here.
My dog is just staring at me – like your horse. When is this going to end?
___
Bec,
That’s why I was appealing to all of you – I don’t KNOW what the first step is! However, one fellow Mudpuppy suggested the first step is WANTING to quit the said addiction…so…this is not a good day to give up Mudflatting! (remember Lloyd Bridges in the movie Airplane?)
Pamela — I think step one in the 12 step process – is to have Obama as president and we can at least rest easier! Until that time, I’m afraid this obsession is not going away.
I’m definitely in for the 12-step program. Where will me meet? I think the live chat room might be in order… I don’t trust myself to be alone!
Okay, I can’t take it anymore. I an done reading the AK newspaper blogs until after the election. I have been fighting the good fight and trying to set the record straight about the train wreck that we will all find ourselves in if McCain/Sarah wins this election, but it turns out Orwell was right, ignorance is strength, or whatever his book said about ignorance, I can’t remember. What sets me off is when someone posts a utube of a Fox News segment that in under a minute blames the entire economic disaster on the Democrats! ARGGGGGGG!
OK – I have to step away from the computer – but thought you’d like this post from Kos on the activities of the candidates today.
Today’s Candidate Schedule
by BarbinMD
Sat Sep 27, 2008 at 06:08:36 AM PDT
Barack Obama & Joe Biden
Greensboro, North Carolina
Washington Street in front of J. Douglas Galyon Depot
12:15 pm (EDT)
Fredricksburg, Virginia
Ball Circle
University of Mary Washington
5:15 PM (EDT)
Michelle Obama & Jill Biden
Tallahassee, Florida
Florida A & M University
Quad Area
11:00 am (EDT)
John McCain
Columbus, Ohio
Aladdin Shrine Temple
5:30 pm (EDT)
Sarah Palin
Memorizing past statements by Henry Kissinger
and – my addition — Palin — worrying about that rally up in Alaska.
Last night McSame reminded me that I live near Wabasha Wisconsin. Why is that…you ask? It is the town in Wisconsin where the movie GRUMPY OLD MEN was shot.
pamelaNo Gravatar (08:20:17) :
Anne,
I’m really trying not to feel sorry for her – after all, she did accept the nomination, but when I read this, it’s hard not to have some sympathy:
___
pamela,
I am not allowing myself to feel sorry for Sarah tight now. I’m an aging hippie and have been through many elections lost due to “dirty politics” and misled public perceptions. However, I do believe her VP pick should continue to be a HUGE indicator (along with oh, so many others) of McCain’s judgment and temperament. As he said last week, he’s a gamblin’ man!
BTW – feel free to join our 12 step conversation on the Forum – General Political Chatter – there are many of us addicts out here!
Thanks, fellow mudpuppies for keeping me up to speed all on all things important in this race.
Both Repubs and Dems need to drop the “it’s your fault for the trillion dollar bailout” and instead all fall on their swords. Although McCain wasn’t there to vote for it (he was campaigning – what a surprise), he did support it.
http://morbidsymptoms.blogspot.com/2008/09/best-vote-john-mccain-never-cast.html
http://malcontends.blogspot.com/2008/09/why-did-anti-regulation-champ-mccain.html
I do prefer to believe that Obama would have voted against this had he been there, just because he would’ve done his research.
“If a general is ignorant of the principle of adaptability, he must not be entrusted with a position of authority.” The Art of War. Obama’s adaptable, McSame’s obviously not.
old salt—
your point is very funny! McCain certainly was a grumpy old man last night, but alas… without any of the warmth or humor of either men in the movie.
Wabasha is on the Minnesota side of the river by the way. (no worries…an easy mistake to make, but one that a proud Minnesotan can’t help but correct.
off topic: Go Twins!!
While to some extent I agree that Obama could have jumped on the vet issue, it DOES make a great commercial! Even I could write that commercial, mclame gave Obama a slam-dunk ad to run until Nov 4th!
RE: SillyWhabbit (08:14:29) :
Any idea how many were watching the debates and mudflatting at the same time?
Since I can’t stand to listen to the condescending meanness of McShame, I muted the TV whenever he came on and read the live Mudflatts feed. Back and forth with the mute button for the whole debate. You guys saved not only my sanity but my blood pressure levels too. Big thanks.
Proud Community OrganizerWA,
would you mind if i use your comment about your son and his bracelets on another website as an argument re mccain and his vet’s record.
a poster there just won’t let it go that mccain is for the vets.
thanks in advance
OK – I have to step away from the computer – but thought you’d like this post from Kos on the activities of the candidates today.
Today’s Candidate Schedule
by BarbinMD
Sat Sep 27, 2008 at 06:08:36 AM PDT
Barack Obama & Joe Biden
Greensboro, North Carolina
Washington Street in front of J. Douglas Galyon Depot
12:15 pm (EDT)
Fredricksburg, Virginia
Ball Circle
University of Mary Washington
5:15 PM (EDT)
Michelle Obama & Jill Biden
Tallahassee, Florida
Florida A & M University
Quad Area
11:00 am (EDT)
John McCain
Columbus, Ohio
Aladdin Shrine Temple
5:30 pm (EDT)
Sarah Palin
Memorizing past statements by Henry Kissinger
and – my addition — Palin — worrying about that rally up in Alaska.
@MissSue (08:25:08) :
Scary.
http://dandelionsalad.wordpress.com/2008/09/24/has-sarah-palin-been-picked-as-the-titular-head-of-the-coming-police-state-by-naomi-wolf/
You are so right, it sent a chill down my spine.
still working on my sign – so far I have SARAH (chuckle)
I’m sure I’ll think of something. I wanted to say a big thank you to Chicago for posting the anti-rally in Philly.
Hi peeps, I’ve been silently reading you for some days now and I’m madly/badly hooked.
I’m Frenchman living in France and consequently can’t vote or anything but I do have my opinions and expectations since most of the US internal policies and problems eventually have an impact round the globe.
I love learning that the pools there give an advantage to the Obama/Biden camp but strangely this feeling isn’t shared with some European media.
See here the BBC analysis about the debate: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7639102.stm
Respondents say Obama won presidential debate
by Channel 2 News staff
Friday, September 26, 2008
ANCHORAGE, Alaska — In a poll conducted Friday, Sept. 26, 2008 Channel 2 News asked respondents if they thought John McCain or Barack Obama won the presidential debate.
Here is the official question and results.
Who won the presidential debate?
John McCain 20%
Barack Obama 80%
I woke up the other morning to a nice clear sky, with the mountains so beautiful with a dusting of fresh snow up around the 4000 foot level. Clear days like these are somewhat rare here in Juneau and for the first 15 minutes or so felt pretty good about things. Then some fear started to seep into my otherwise beautiful morning. I started thinking that Sarah was out there somewhere, making a fool of herself, but out there none the less. Then as I tried to process my fear of a McCain Sarah administration and to rationalize it the best way I could. I came up with this. Sarah Palin is Mother natures revenge on the world for fouling Alaska’s coastlines with oil in 1989, and for allowing her soils to be stripped away for shiny metals. The world has been behaving badly towards the earth, with the naked apes placing so much value on things made from plastic, polluting the oceans with plastic, that it is fitting that Mother gives us exactly what we all seem to want, a plastic vice president! Sarah represents plastic and now we can all choke on it! Or start to wise up.. It is never too late! I hope Biden shows no mercy at the debate…
Oh no — hose hotrod. You can’t be cheering on the Twins here! Last night we had the debate on the TV. On my laptop I had the Mudflat blog in one window, the White Sox Gameday in another, AND the Twins game in another. We both lost last night – this is agonizing.
Just so you know – Obama is a White Sox fan – NOT CUBS. So it is your duty in Minn to lose the rest of your games so he, and I, can have some happiness in this crazy last days of the campaign.
@ pamela
I just read the article you linked to. One thing that struck me about SP’s interview with Katie Couric is how she looked — exhausted, beaten, almost defeated. She didn’t have the sparkle that she showed at the convention or on a lot of her other appearances. Perhaps it was a bad makeup job, but it seemed more than that — much more. It almost seemed like she was nearing a total emotional breakdown.
Katie handled her like you would a child. The questions were reasonable, probing but not designed to trap an informed candidate. Katie was really very gentle with her, almost as if she was afraid to probe too deep for fear that Sarah would dissolve right before her. Katie kept her head low rather than boring into Sarah. Her voice was calm, gentle — it seemed that she was almost trying to protect her. And I don’t mean protect her from the questions — but protect her emotionally. Amazing.
I’m surprised that nobody else here has commented on that. Maybe I missed it. Sarah’s responses were almost incoherent. Perhaps people are having a hard time getting past that.
Here’s a question, why do all the pundits and candidates confuse leadership with damage control? If you’ve helped to set the town on fire, rushing to the front of the bucket brigade isn’t leadership, it’s damage control. If you’ve let Wall Street run wild, cleaning up after the stampede isn’t leadership, it’s damage control. Heroes run to the rescue but then they ride off into the sunset. They don’t stay to rebuild and teach others to avoid the pitfalls in the first place. If you have no coherent plan and your judgement is wrong or suspect from the beginning then you spend all your time lurching from one crisis to another. That’s not leadership; it’s damage control. God knows this country is in damage control mode now but we need leaders to move us forward. Some one who thinks beyond how to put out the next fire. Why isn’t that obvious to all of us gagging on the smoke?
Check out the Cafferty video and blogspace….
http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/09/26/cafferty.fri.cnn
Kokofish Palin:
“Tipping point states” change somewhat from week to week. They’re states which would alter the outcome of a close election if it were decided differently. For a thorough discussion, see here: http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/07/tipping-point-v20.html
A tipping point state is a state where you maximize the value of your volunteer time, and Nate Silver has a chart of them that he updates as the polls change. So as it got closer to the time to go elsewhere, check this chart. Nevada’s the Number 7 tipping point state at the moment.
This site http://www.fivethirtyeight.com is run by an Obama supporter who knows his statistics (he works for Baseball Prospectus, and created the number that helps ball clubs project the value of a particular player. Lots of money rides on his understanding of statistics)
It’s well worth everyone’s time to visit this site and wander around it.
Epic: “We really do have to keep the pressure on right to the end. We can’t lose this one.”
You are so right… we must keep the pressure up… register voters, phonebank, canvass. We cannot sit down no matter what the polls say!
Right now there’s a live Obama rally being covered (in North Carolina) on MSNBC. Thousands of very enthusiastic supporters there
JeanneNo Gravatar (08:53:52) :
Here’s a question, why do all the pundits and candidates confuse leadership with damage control?
___
Jeanne – RATINGS!
Last night was a blast! Talking to everyone while the debate was happening made it feel like I was the same room as all of you! Thanks so much Mudflatters!!!
C aka FilterSkatePalin
No Gravatar (01:01:16) : She is in waaaaay over her head. I hope she really does put the country first and just bow out gracefully. I even promise to be nice to her if she decides to do that. No hard feelings, really!
I have to disagree with you on this. I think that’s exactly the wrong attitude to take; it will only give her encouragement to go for it again. What about Troopergate? What about the per diems for her and her whole family? What about shady campaign contributions and gifts? What about Creationism in your schools? What about her earmarks? What about all the lies, secrecy, and vengeance? What about inept governing? What about all the cover ups? What about her husband sitting in on meetings and getting cc’d on confidential meetings? What about witness tampering? What about her husband being paid for – what? What about aerial hunting? What about her worldview that destroys the environment? What about her record on native Alaskans? What about her general ineptness? …and on and on and on…
If she goes back to Alaska in disgrace, I bet she’ll cry and whimper about how “they made me do it, honest, I was still true to Alaska.” That’s going to win over some people, who think a recall, a trial, or impeachment is just sooooo much trouble, and let’s just live and let live.
This woman needs to be brought to justice.
@akbearable:
I do not even bother reading Alaska news blogs/comments. Pure poison! The intelligent voters of Alaska are getting their news fix at blogs like this (& the other great blog/news links so thoughtfully provided by AKMudflats and its readers) and reputable OUTSIDE news agencies. I have not watched Fox news in over 5 years. That is the hearth around which the conservatives gather — even when I was a registered repub I found it was too much for my stomach! I don’t take anything that they say seriously, and I don’t think that anyone giving serious thought to who they are voting for does either. And if you’re talking about the comments at the Anchorage Daily News, I’d rather have you set my head on fire & put it out with a sledgehammer than read all of that hate! Don’t go there! It takes too long to get that horrible stuff out of your head and return to a good state of mind…………..
The repub surrogate on MSNBC said Mc probably didn’t look at Obama because, if he did, he could “look right through him!” Grrr!
Let ‘em spin…but Let’s GIT R DUN for OBAMA (that’s my Larry the Cable Guy imitation!)
I’m posting a big chunk of this because I know you will enjoy it.
By MARK HALPERIN / OXFORD, MISSISSIPPI
GRADING THE DEBATE
John McCain
Substance: His arguments were hard to follow at the beginning, but he found his voice as the debate progressed, although he never seemed fully in control of his message. He had plenty to say about the economy, Iraq, Afghanistan, and Russia, but often bogged down his own answers when trying to unfurl quips and soundbites. Stuck with bumper sticker slogans on the economy, and while he got a bit more detailed on foreign policy, he stayed at his usual level of abstraction. If he truly knows more about the world than Obama, he didn’t show it in this debate.
Grade: B-
Style: Cluttered, jumpy, and often muddled. Frequent coughing early on helped neither his arguments nor his image. Jokes about being deaf and anecdotes about Normandy and George Shultz seemed ill-advised – even his pen was old. His presentation was further hindered by his wandering discussion of the differing heights of North and South Koreans and his angry assertion about how well he knows Henry Kissinger. Fell into the classic politician’s trap of inserting familiar stump speech applause lines into debate responses – which only works if done with enthusiasm and clarity (and if received by applause – a big No-No in Lehrer’s auditorium, which the audience obeyed seriously and silently). Keenly aware of the grand, grave occasion, McCain wavered between respectful and domineering, and ended up awkward and edgy.
Grade: C-
Offense: Emphasized his bread and butter issues of taxes and spending, and hit Obama on his failure to visit Iraq and his expressed willingness to meet with dictators. But while mocking his opponent on a few occasions, which reflected his acute disrespect for Obama, he did so in an insufficiently sharp and detailed manner – and unevenly worked elements of his rival’s record into his attacks. Still he was utterly confident about his own experience, knowledge, and policies, even when tripped by his own tongue and distracted by the strains of debate practice. The main problem: Obama’s obvious preparation and sharp answers contradicted McCain’s frequent claims that the Democrat was uninformed and “didn’t understand” key issues.
Grade: C+
Defense: He managed to ignore most of Obama’s jibes, but was eventually baited into giving an extended answer about his policy differences with President Bush, after his opponent repeatedly mentioned McCain’s regular support of Bush’s budgets. Was visibly riled when clashing with Obama over a variety of issues, including Iraq, sanctions, and spending. He also chose to boast about Sarah Palin (although not by name) as his maverick partner, who, after her shaky week, may no longer be his ace in the hole.
Grade: B-
Overall: McCain was McCain – evocative, intense, and at times emotional, but also vague, elliptical, and atonal. Failed to deliver his “country first versus Obama first” message cleanly, even when offered several opportunities. Surprisingly, did not talk much about “change,” virtually ceding the dominant issue of the race.
Overall grade: B-
Barack Obama
Substance: Quite manifestly immersed in the past, present, and future details of policy, and eager to express his views, which have been expanded, honed, and solidified during the last 18 months of hard campaigning. Still, he did avoid the nitty-gritty details of policy positions in favor of broad principles and references to working Americans, thereby not presenting the kind of specifics that some voters are waiting to hear from him.
Grade: B+
Style: Polished, confident, focused. Fully prepared, and able to convey a real depth of knowledge on nearly every issue. He was unhurried, and rarely lost his train of thought even when the debate wended and winded – and uttered far fewer of his trademark, distracting, “ums.” At times, however, Obama revealed the level of his preparation by faltering over a rehearsed answer. He seemed to deliberately focus on the moderator and the home audience, with McCain as an afterthought – except when on the attack. Chose to avoid humor, for the most part, in favor of a stern demeanor, and in the process, came off as cool as a cucumber.
Grade: A
Offense: Linking McCain to Bush in his very first answer, he kept it up as his primary line of attack. Forcefully hit McCain for his early support of the Iraq War. Though he never drew blood, he did keep McCain a bit off balance, often with clever references to McCain’s recent statements.
Grade: B
Defense: Had a reasonable answer for every charge that came his way – with little anger, bluster, or anxiety. Often interrupting McCain attacks with swift explanations and comebacks, he managed to spin accusations of being liberal as evidence of his relentless opposition to George Bush (in replies that were clearly planned). Offered a rather clumsy alternative to McCain’s well-known, moving story of wearing the bracelet of a soldier lost in Iraq (a gift from the soldier’s mother), with a story about a bracelet of his own. Fearless, without condescension, he attempted the gracious move of agreeing with or complimenting a McCain position, occasionally to his own detriment.
Grade: A-
Overall: Went for a solid, consistent performance to introduce himself to the country. He did not seem nervous, tentative, or intimidated by the event, and avoided mistakes from his weak debate performances during nomination season (a professorial tone and long winded answers). Standing comfortably on the stage with his rival, he showed he belonged – evocative of Reagan, circa 1980. He was so confident by the end that he reminded his biggest audience yet that his father was from Kenya. Two more performances like that and he will be very tough to beat on Election Day.
Overall grade: A-
lavndrblueNo Gravatar (09:03:35) :
Last night was a blast! Talking to everyone while the debate was happening made it feel like I was the same room as all of you! Thanks so much Mudflatters!!!
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Lav,
I feel the same – a good time with like-minded (clear minded!) people!
lemonfairNo Gravatar (02:11:47) : “It’s hard to reach across the aisle when you won’t look across the aisle.”
ROFL! Oh, I love that!
@Bec & hose hotrod
Off topic – Sorry one of you has to lose, but if misery loves company, I’m rooting for the Mets and their campaign seems to be going the way we’re all hoping McCain’s does…Time to leave this blog and listen to baseball
lemonfairNo Gravatar (02:27:38) : Epic, et al: I’m pretty sure she can’t be kicked off the ticket, because she’s been officially nominated by the party.
No, she wasn’t. McClueless was nominated by the Party; then he chose her. Maybe he can unchoose her?
@AnnieinWA & Proud
You stories are so sad, many of us “aging hippies” are against this war, as we were against the Vietnam war, but don’t have loved ones fighting the war. It certainly brings it all back home. I also met Eugene McCarthy in Oakland, CA.
What a wonderful president he would have made.
On a lighter note, I’ve never seen McCain hug anyone but Lieberman. He & Cindy Lou seem to have a strange, cold relationship.
bec in illinois–
Just so you know – Obama is a White Sox fan – NOT CUBS. So it is your duty in Minn to lose the rest of your games so he, and I, can have some happiness in this crazy last days of the campaign.
—-
au contraire! since Minnesota is a battleground state (and Illinois isn’t), I think it’s your (and our future Prez’s) duty to throw support OUR way. Go Twins!
Why is it when a bully (McCain) throws some good punches (Lies) in the school yard, (Last nights debate) then these same thugs say they won? The bullies always get theirs in the end. (ALWAYS)
The truth always wins. That’s what the bullies are afraid of. They pee in their pants like the children they really are when confronted with the truth.
A 100% voter turnout of Democrats will crush these filthy thugs and make the Republican Party a quaint memory to tell your grandchildren about.
Derek Rock CraneNo Gravatar (03:43:50) : That said, Obama was MUCH steadier and fact-equipped, and I REALLY got tired of McC’s continual patronizing tone. I’m amazed he managed to get through the whole 90 min. w/o once saying “Boy” … pompous old fart.
So true, so true…
I have read a lot of comments that people were disappointed in Obama for not being more aggressive towards McCain. I disagree. He made a calculated decision to use his time to talk about what it is he has to give to this country. And by being respectful of McCain while McCain sneered and refused to make eye contact, Obama came off as being very Presidential and McCain came off as being a petulant angry old man.
Then when Obama threw the President of Spain at him, McCain said “horseshit” twice. Nice temper there McCain. Not to mention pointing out how old he is. Who says “horseshit” other than very old people?
SMRNo Gravatar (09:09:14) :” I’d rather have you set my head on fire & put it out with a sledgehammer than read all of that ”
LOL!!!!!!
What time is the AK rally?
Interesting debate. I am glad that got into the complexity of foreign policy a bit. Probably over most people’s heads, though. Listening to McCain with his snearing, belittling comments, I can see that he a Palin are two of the same. We don’t need these nasty tactics in our country. We need someone with some morality. I am surprised that Obama got criticzed for being merely considerate by saying “You’re right John.” It just show he is willing to communicate and be empathetic. My goodness — what if we actually had KIND leaders in this country? GOBAMA!
@LoveUSA
Wow! We were all in France a couple of years ago, a skiing trip to Courchavel. Are you the only person left in France who loves the USA? Sadly, I didn’t meet any. I take heart in your comment, as it gives me hope — hope that there are others in countries outside the US who have found that there are U.S. blogs where reasonable people gather. I know that everyone — in the US and outside the US — stumble across the sites with stories or comments full of vitriol & neo-con hate-mongering, and it scares us in the US as much (or more) as anyone outside the US.
I’ve just returned from living in the UK for several years. We’re oil industry, and let me tell you, almost all of our friends were locals or expats from countries other than the US. Even I couldn’t stomach the US expats, the oil industry is saturated with religious types from the bible belt, nothing in common with them whatsoever.
That being the case, while I understand what the BBC article was saying (having been in discussions with Brits for many years about our politics), they are looking at it from a different perspective. We, here in the US, are looking for someone to lead our country, and we are focusing on the issues that are most important to us. We are also a nation that is weary & disillusioned. I have a Barack Obama t-shirt. I don’t have one that says BARACK OBAMA ’08 in big letters or anything like that. I have the one that says “Got Hope?” (like the big “got milk?” ad campaign that has been going on in the US for years & years & years). Bottom line is that the BBC article was pretty clinical in its evaluation of the debate, but Americans are too emotionally charged right now to view it in such a detached manner.
I am so glad to hear that Obama got such great reviews from around the US.
Get hope everyone!
And thanks LoveUSA for joining Mudflats! It’s an exceptional place to visit!
Instead of blaming the each other for the economic debacle in this country, Repubs and Democrats should all be falling on their swords, except Obama, he wasn’t around.
McCain wasn’t there for the vote (he was campaigning – what a surprise) but he supported it.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/wallstreet/weill/demise.html
http://morbidsymptoms.blogspot.com/2008/09/best-vote-john-mccain-never-cast.html
PhoebeNo Gravatar (09:17:22) :
@AnnieinWA & Proud
You stories are so sad, many of us “aging hippies” are against this war, as we were against the Vietnam war, but don’t have loved ones fighting the war. It certainly brings it all back home. I also met Eugene McCarthy in Oakland, CA.
What a wonderful president he would have made.
___
Phoebe,
What’s that they say about 6 degrees of separation? I was born in Richmond, CA and spent much of my adolescent life protesting about the war in Viet Nam.
What a wonderful world this could be…ahhh…vintage Sam Cooke
The rally is at noon (we’ll leave here in about 1-1/2 hours). And I have your sign ready. Sorry it’s not fancy with nice pictures of jeeps or anything, but I am definately not the creative type!
Anne in WA
I saw that too! Absolutely incredible. Besides the arrogance of what she said, she was a Congresswoman!. I didn’t catch her name. Someone at another site I comment on made a great point:
The McCain campaign spent a lot of time making Obama look like a piece of fluff, with the “One” ad, etc., and so they actually lowered expectations for Obama for this debate, which he easily exceeded.
Anne, Phoebe –
There seem to be a lot of us aging hippies visiting the mudflats.
Proud Progressive LiberalNo Gravatar (05:05:42) : Moderator, You need to have the links we provide in our posts open in a new window. Otherwise we lose your site.
Proud, you are the one who controls where a linked page opens. If you have Firefox, you go into Tools/Options/Tabs and select “Always show the Tab Bar.” Then, when you want to open a linked page, you right-click on the link and choose “Open Link in New Tab.”
That’s the way I like to do it, because I don’t have to mess with multiple windows. But you can also simply right-click on a link and choose either “Open in New Window” or “Open Link in New Tab.”
SMR, the people who have visited the USA love it. For others, mostly don’t understand how it is over there and some mix up American politics with American people… until they get the chance to visit
Anne and Phoebe… count me in with the aging hippie crowd. Mudflats released my inner activist and while I am driving my family crazy, it’s good to feel this hopeful and energized again!
katiebegoodNo Gravatar (09:23:22) :
I have read a lot of comments that people were disappointed in Obama for not being more aggressive towards McCain. I disagree. He made a calculated decision to use his time to talk about what it is he has to give to this country. And by being respectful of McCain while McCain sneered and refused to make eye contact, Obama came off as being very Presidential and McCain came off as being a petulant angry old man.
Then when Obama threw the President of Spain at him, McCain said “horseshit” twice. Nice temper there McCain. Not to mention pointing out how old he is. Who says “horseshit” other than very old people?
___
Katie,
I agree with you about Obama’s calculated decision to use him time wisely and remain respectful and was glad the “horseshit” remarks were picked up on audio (chuckled when I heard that!). But don’t underestimate us “old folks” – we can cuss, using much more current VERBIAGE, with the best of ‘em.
However, like Obama, we try to use our words and manners to express our beliefs and emotions, although it doesn’t always work for me!
Love your comments!
SMRNo Gravatar (09:33:28) :
The rally is at noon (we’ll leave here in about 1-1/2 hours). And I have your sign ready. Sorry it’s not fancy with nice pictures of jeeps or anything, but I am definitely not the creative type!
———————————————————————-
What color poster paint did I get on my thumb when you made it?
Thanks, again! ( to all of you!)
I am so looking forward to hearing about the rally in Alaska today! I wish I could be there to participate!
In the many, many comments about the possibility of Sarah being removed in some way from the ticket–either by choice or forced off–I have not seen any discussion concerning the fact that early voting has already started in some states with her name on the ballet. Also, the ballets are probably already prepared for the election in all of the states. What are the legal ramifications of changing the ticket at this point in the process? I was just wondering.
lemonfairNo Gravatar (09:35:54) :
Anne, Phoebe – and Nebraska too
There seem to be a lot of us aging hippies visiting the mudflats.
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Lemon,
Once again, I am convinced I am in good company!
I am listening to a special about Paul Newman’s career. Is it only me, or does it seem like just yesterday we were all mere children ourselves? Yikes! I do NOT relate to my age at all.
Nebraska Native AKA Froth Moonshine PalinNo Gravatar (09:39:26)
:Anne and Phoebe… count me in with the aging hippie crowd. Mudflats released my inner activist and while I am driving my family crazy, it’s good to feel this hopeful and energized again!
___
Nebraska,
AMEN! Like his daughter Caroline, I have not had a candidate inspire me so since John and Robert Kennedy! Go hippies GO!
Good Luck Alaskans with the rally today! Cannot wait to read all about it right here.
Just perused this thread.. and as usual great and insightful comments. (I LOVE THIS PLACE!!)
But a special call out to these neighbors- you really touched me today…
Proud Community Org. in WA
Your story was very moving. I wish Obama had said more to refute McCains’s assertion that he new the Vets and would take care of the vets and the Vets knew him etc. But, on further reflection, maybe the Vets DO KNOW MCCAIN, and Obama knows they do- and nothing more needed to be said.
Tell your SIL we commend his great service to his country- and hope this war will end soon
MJC
“Over the past several months, I have concluded that the greatest difference (in my opinion) between Obama and McCain is this: Barak Obama has a Moral Compass. It is not something you can learn, it is something you are born with. Either you have it or you don’t. And if you do have it, is the trait to which you strive to live your entire life by. It is the driving force that directs your path in life. ”
ITA! I think this is SPOT ON! and this country needs to find its moral compass again.
Bec
“I mean – if he agrees with McCain and thinks he is right on these issues – then wouldn’t that be a “good thing”? Silly me.”
GREAT SPIN to this.. hee hee.. you are SPOT on! and frankly I think ppl will just see this as a cheap shot my McCain
Aging Hippies
Hey, we could start a movement!!!!! I guess we all just need a safe place to hang out.
Obama isn’t mean spirited, so the nasty zingers don’t come to him as easily as they do to McCain. I truly believe McCain needs some anger management therapy & by the end of this campaign I may too.
@lemonfair
“Anne, Phoebe -
There seem to be a lot of us aging hippies visiting the mudflats.”
It would be interesting to know how many of us are of the age range that would make us “old hippies” – 65+?
My hand is raised.
From CNN on the debate:
Thinking about the following characteristics and qualities, please say whether you think each one better described Barack Obama or John McCain during tonight’s debate:
• Was more intelligent: Obama 55%, McCain 30%
• Expressed his views more clearly: Obama 53%, McCain 36%
• Spent more time attacking his opponent: McCain 60%, Obama 23%
• Was more sincere and authentic: Obama 46%, McCain 38%
• Seemed to be the stronger leader: Obama 49%, McCain 43%
• Was more likeable: Obama 61%, McCain 26%
• Was more in touch with the needs and problems of people like you: Obama 62%, McCain 32%
When McCain was talking about the tax code and changing the tax brackets last night, I caught at least two times when he spoke about “dividends.”
Did anyone else catch that? I do believe he was trying to talk about “exemptions,” not dividends. So how well does he know the ins and outs of income tax?
Just checking back and catching up on comments.
Fawnskin Clipdragon mudpuppy: Thank you for asking and yes I am giving you permission to reuse my original post about my SIL. Also sugget that they google the Veteran websites such as Votevets.org. Also an excellent article on Military.com by Dr. Phillip Butler who knew Senator McCain at the Naval Acadamy and was also in the Hanoi Hilton (7 1/2 years). Very thought provoking and gives excellent insight. He states why he will not be voting for John McCain.
AnnieWA and Phoebe: Thank you for your kind and caring comments. I am also going to end up in the 12 step program before this is all over. I am just hoping it will be for letting go of this election and not for the possible excessive tippling that may come about if the McCain/Palin ticket gets elected.
Susie in JerseyNo Gravatar (09:57:17) :
@lemonfair
“Anne, Phoebe -
There seem to be a lot of us aging hippies visiting the mudflats.”
It would be interesting to know how many of us are of the age range that would make us “old hippies” – 65+?
My hand is raised.
___
Susie,
60 here (until next week…then 61!) but I started protesting at a young age!
As another aging hippie it’s great to find a place among like-minded folks.
What strikes me most about the Mudflats population is the expanded world view shared by so many residents here.
Many, if not most, have actually traveled or lived outside the US, unlike so many in the overall population who may not have even traveled outside their own state. Like Sarah Palin they have no knowledge of the world’s diversity, nor do they feel any connection or responsibility to the welfare of the planet and the world’s population in general.
Ooops should have been AnneinWA! Shame on me.
Proud Community OrganizerWANo Gravatar (10:03:37) :
AnnieWA and Phoebe: Thank you for your kind and caring comments. I am also going to end up in the 12 step program before this is all over. I am just hoping it will be for letting go of this election and not for the possible excessive tippling that may come about if the McCain/Palin ticket gets elected.
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Proud,
I simply cannot allow myself, at this point, to think that a McCain/Palin presidency could happen. If it does materialize, I will be forced to deal with it…but NOT NOW. In fact, I need to get off this computer and back to work for Obama!
Does it count being an aging hippie in spirit, but born in the 70s????
You’re all wonderful – I feel so lucky to have met all of you through this place!
65 years old here and taking very badly with finding myself in a demographic that’s meant to be against Obama–presumably because we’re considered to have lost so many neurons we can no longer think logically. Listen up MSM, we’re not all John McCains thank you!
Age 55 here. A little young to be a true hippie – but I lived in Carbondale, IL at the height of it – Southern Illinois U town — war moratorium – they burned down old main. National Guard camped out in my high school gym – spring 1970. Also – we visited my relatives in San Fran during the Summer of Love. Walked Haight-Ashbury. My aunt and uncle took us to visit communes and we picked up the hippie hitchhikers just to have a chat. So I hope I count a little.
I had a real awakening when Martin Luther King died – lived in a small town in Ohio then. We had a candlelight vigil-walk downtown – and some friends were too afraid to participate. Went from that shortly to hippieland in C’dale. Quite a change-up.
@A Brit abroad
Absolutely, the more the merrier.
A Brit abroad aka Flag CobraNo Gravatar (10:09:44) ::
Does it count being an aging hippie in spirit, but born in the 70s????
You’re all wonderful – I feel so lucky to have met all of you through this place!
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Brit,
ABSOLUTELY! You are now crowned an “honorary hippie!” It’s funny – in the 60′s our parents thought it was a bad thing!
Thanks for watching our backs while we sleep!
OK – I’m STILL in PJs. Have a ton of work to do. It is a spectacularly beautiful day outside here in Illinois. And I’m here on my computer.
I officially declare the launching of Election-oholics Anonymous, Mudflats Chapter.
Step one (of 12) – go get dressed!
Rust MustangNo Gravatar (10:11:47) :
65 years old here and taking very badly with finding myself in a demographic that’s meant to be against Obama–presumably because we’re considered to have lost so many neurons we can no longer think logically. Listen up MSM, we’re not all John McCains thank you!
___
Rust,
MAYBE US HIPPIES ARE THE OCTOBER (nov) SURPRISE!
Bec in IllinoisNo Gravatar (10:12:57) :
Age 55 here. A little young to be a true hippie-
___
BEC,
you’re also crowned and official honorary hippie
A must read article by Sydney H. Schanberg
McCain and the POW Cover-up
The “war hero” candidate buried information about POWs left behind in Vietnam
http://www.nationinstitute.org/p/schanberg09182008pt1
Bec in IllinoisNo Gravatar (10:16:23) :
OK – I’m STILL in PJs. Have a ton of work to do. It is a spectacularly beautiful day outside here in Illinois. And I’m here on my computer.
I officially declare the launching of Election-oholics Anonymous, Mudflats Chapter.
Step one (of 12) – go get dressed!
___
Okay Bec,
I am outta’ here for step 1 – after I check the forum
I woke up to the news this morning that Paul Newman died. He was a man of integrity and compassion, a supporter of liberal causes, an incredibly gifted actor. His passing is a loss to the world.
This aging hippy, — meaning I’m 67 and was in NYC for the 60s’ — wishes all good energy of that time to “Alaskans for Truth” this afternoon.
This seems the perfect time to bring up a thought I had last night about Mudflats and this community that has been created.
We don’t usually reveal or share what race each of us is. But I’m guessing there are a large number of us who are white. I just want to say that I’ve (ovbiously) never had a time when I’ve been in conversation with hundreds of people where race is not an issue. It is a wonderful thing. I think this is my favorite thing about Mudflats. This freedom to not fear hearing some nasty racist remark coming next. You see it on so many other comment boards all over the internet. It always disgusts me.
I hope Mudflats is filled with all races, religions, beliefs. I believe it is. It is a respectful place. And I love seeing on TV all the crowds of young and old, often mostly white, out there supporting Obama. Have we turned a corner here? At least a bit? We can’t ever wipe it out completely of course. But Mudflats is a good place to be and feel the love, tolerance, discussion, and HOPE!
I’m even younger than bec– just 52. But I like to think of “hippy” as a choice available to all of us, maybe also a philosophy of mind. I’m definitely there, very “old school” if you will! Please, may I be included? And I love the idea of a “hippy” October surprise! of the 60+ crowd rising up for Obama.
The truth is we need every demographic to rise up. No rest for the leary. Keep your guard up. Keep talking, keep volunteering, donating, etc. and lets get out those votes!
Hey, LoveUSA! Here’s a good ole South Carolina welcome to you!
I’m as grateful to know there’s a Frenchman who cares about us, as you might be to know we aren’t all crazy over here.
All the best!
@scaredinfairbanks
I read somewhere that Paul Newman was on Richard Nixon’s enemy list. Paul said that that was one of his ” greatest achievements”. He gave over 200 million to charities. He will be missed.
Bec in IllinoisNo Gravatar (10:31:21) :
We’re becoming Stephen Colbert …at Mudflats, over the computer…no one can see color!
It’s about time!
…and I’m 60!
I also gave this one to Obama on my Blog, anyone can check and see my opinion.
I also said I expect Sarah to be a no show next week..maybe she will be kidnapped by aliens..
hose hotrod palinNo Gravatar (10:33:58)
Of course you’re one of us!
For us to be the October Surprise, some of us got going way too early for that…but we’re still at it! I’ve two more weeks to continue register voters and I’m doing it!
@ Rust Mustang
“myself in a demographic that’s meant to be against Obama–presumably because we’re considered to have lost so many neurons we can no longer think logically.”
I know of only 1 person my age who will probably vote for McCain – and she’s never voted anything but Republican in her whole life.
How can anyone who lived through Vietnam vote Republican?
I’ve read that because Obama is knocking McCain for his age, we older folks don’t like him. All the old folks I know are agreeing that McCain is too old and probably not in the best of health.
Susie in Jersey (11:06:48) said:
How can anyone who lived through Vietnam vote Republican?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Maybe they’re like McCain and want a different outcome? Maybe they believe McCain is the one to bring victory after a failed war.
What Obama didn’t say last night, and should have, is that even Patreus, whom McCain invoked over and over, has said that he can’t use the word victory when talking about Iraq.
I think there are people who are genuinely afraid of change. Obama not only offers the idea of change, he looks different, and that’s a change.
Incumbents often win. While I think it’s a great strategy to tie McCain to Bush’s failed policies, McCain is almost an incumbent.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
For me, things were summed up pretty nicely when Lehrer asked what changes would the candidates make to their proposed budgets, given the current economy. McCain wouldn’t touch the Dep’t of Defense or vets. Considering he doesn’t fund the vets, no cost cutting there. How ’bout not “awarding” contracts to friends (Hello Bush) and go with that competition thing you say works so well. (By the way, I agree that competition does drive the economy.)
Force defense contractors to bid on the coveted contracts. Hold them to their budget.
Obama said he’d have to delay some of his proposals. Fair enough. I don’t think any candidate can come through on all they promise. But I can’t recall what he said he’d delay.
I’m assuming we’ll hear more in the economy debate.
Can a 47 year old Irish woman be an aging hippie too?
I will be 65 on 10/21…so my hand is raised. Now I know where all the flower’s went…..long time passing…good to see you kids again….such a nice gathering, too.
And my silk screen is out of the basement and ready for paint. Now, I just have to decide from all these great choices. Lawn signs go up 10/4 here in ID. But I still have my Obama Unity sign in my front window.
I bought some Avery white printable magnet sheets for ink jet printer at Stables and have been making Obama car signs for all my hippie friends. Who says us flower children can’t learn new things.
@Bec in Illinois
This website is a godsend. I came across a Rebublican website today ( I think its called TownHall – anyway it was where the conservative female writer, can’t think of her name, urged Sarah Palin to step down). There were over 600 comments to her article and I decided to read them in order to try and see what perspective “the other side” were coming from. I was astounded at the rage directed at the author of this piece. I was also astounded at the outright stupidity of about 90% of the comments. People in effect were willing to be submitted to 4-8 more years of the same crap, just to get in the Republicans. The failings of Palin were glossed over. These people are not the brightest bulbs on the planet and yet their vote will determine what happens to a lot of people not just in America, but in the rest of the world. An intelligent man from Africa posted a comment and was told to but out – it was none of his business. I also saw a despicable racist comment about Obama. I was truly sickened and frightened by the venom that I saw there.
To be fair, there were a number of posters (very much in the minority) stating that with the addition of Sarah Palin to the ticket, they could not in good conscience vote for McCain.
Such a relief to get back to the Mudflats and hear humanity and intelligence prevail.
I know what you mean Irishgirl. I stepped away from Mudflats and dipped my toe into the local “letters to the editors” comment board and was blasted with 60 comments about how wonderful Sarah is and how great it is that she is “saving” McCain and the world. Those bornagain folks are just plain rude, crude, and way more vicious than I would have believed, until I read it with my own eyes. My ears are not so willing to hear that kind of language, so I don’t even bother to go there on radio or TV.
Irish girl – you are in! Hippie is a state of mind.
I was enjoying on my car radio yesterday a new version of Joni’s Big Yellow Taxi — they paved paradise to put up a parking lot.
I still have my Joan Baez Songbook. Taught myself to play the guitar with that, and my Peter, Paul and Mary songbooks.
Senior year of high school my best friend worked the concession stand at the local movie theater and I hung out there a few times to see Woodstock movie. Nice memories.
NMJ ty
My husband and I just took a walk to make me step away from the computer. We were talking about WHY people would vote McCain-Palin.
My take – it is in their DNA AND/OR there are those who will not examine issues intellectually. In their own little world and happy, thank you very much.
But many on here are showing that once a Republican doesn’t have to mean ALWAYS a Republican. We have to be willing to switch parties when we know it is for the best interests of our families, the country, and the world.
Oh, I’m glad to say, one of my bornagain friends just called to remind me not all of them have the same view as those that were being said on the board I’d just been visiting. She admitted that she was lerking and heartsick about how some of her fellow church goers where acting. I know better than to put every bornagain Christian in the same basket. Rotten eggs come in all shapes and colors and just because a person doesn’t agree with me doesn’t mean they are a rotten egg, either.
Lived on Oak Street (one of the streets going into Golden Gate Park. Part of the Panhandle) during the “Summer of Love”. Watched Kesey’s bus from my balcony window. Wonderful sights and sounds. Went to Berkeley from 1959-1965 (okay, it took me a long time, worked two jobs). LITTLE OLD FOR TRUE “HIPPIEDOM”! Now 68. But sure did demonstrate and wave a lot of signs! Got arrested a few times, too. Was in down town San Francisco the day Kennedy was shot, looking up at the Chronical Building with the neon sign with current news going around the building. Sure seems like yesterday. Kennedy was my “Hero”, Obama is the first one that has come close since. I am so looking forward to his election. Will be exciting times again, filled with hope and renewal. Lord, gives 8 years!
Thanks for the great post, femalady. I don’t think there has really been anyone this inspirational since Kennedy either.
Obama — Keep him safe.
Thanks, Bec. And yes, keep Obama safe! We do tend to exterminate the very best among us! Jack, Martin, Bobby, et al. We can be the greatest people in the world but, then, how truly awful we can be! And it seems to be getting worse!
And yes, keep Obama safe!
I think that is preying on everyone’s mind.
AnneinWA (09:10:38) :
“The repub surrogate on MSNBC said Mc probably didn’t look at Obama because, if he did, he could “look right through him!” Grrr!”
You mean they’re actually admitting that Obama is completely transparent while their candidate is totally murky.
gary aka khaki salmon palinNo Gravatar (10:26:43) :
This aging hippy, — meaning I’m 67 and was in NYC for the 60s’ — wishes all good energy of that time to “Alaskans for Truth” this afternoon.
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Here’s one for you Brother. I’m 62 but I feel 19 except when I feel 62. What a time it was. Maybe we all need to listen to Henry McCullough’s infamous C-D-E intro rock slur on his beloved Gibson Les Paul Goldtop of those days. That infamous rock slur with out of phase maximum overdrive humbucking pickups now really does apply to everyone’s new found friends here in the infinite MudFlats!
I was seated on the ground about 35 feet from Henry right at the front dead center of the huge stage with about 100,000 people at 10 AM in the morning at the Kensington Cricket Oval in London in the summer of 1971, when the Grease Band started the entire concert with that famous Gibson Led Paul rock slur. They played it just themselves without Joe Cocker who was elsewhere at the time. But they did a wonderful version that day. Yes. If you were alive and of age in those days, you see the world completely differently.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOwl_APqVm4
But Joe is still going strong. Just like all the Mudflatters here! I played in a rock band for several years in the 70′s. There is no greater joy in life than having three female backup singers behind you! That is why I just love this second video here of Joe so much!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wG6Cgmgn5U
Thanks HamletsMills – I’m listening to the 2nd Cocker video now — Little Help With My Friends — and getting chills!
I loved John Belushi when he did his Joe routine on SLN, too!
Obama is going to get by with a little help from his friends — US!
Watching the first one now – I’d say Joe was the origianl “Guitar Hero”!
I’m overjoyed – just got off the phone with my childhood housekeeper. (I’m now 46, she left when I was 19, but we usually speak once a week.)
Inititally, she wasn’t going to vote. Didn’t see the point. Asked her today if she’s registered to vote. “Oh, yes!” And she’s voting Obama. Someone was at her place this week fixing her sink and she asked him if he’s registered to vote. She told him not to wear any Obama paraphernalia when he votes. He didn’t know why, and this woman who never graduated from high school told him his vote is private and there’s no need to broadcast to the world who he’s voting for. (She didn’t want to explain the real reason because she didn’t want him to try and defy the powers that be.) My point is that the campaign is getting the word out to the smallest trailer parks and the people are hearing it. You’re vote must be counted! Don’t let the Republicans turn you away on a technicality.
Her sister went to Tallahassee today to see Michelle Obama speak. She figured it would be easy to see her because there was some big football game and most of the students would be at that. Nope, crowds galore. There might not be a lot of press coverage on Michelle’s solo engagements, but she’s bringing out the voters.
My mother, the perfect McCain demographic has been telling me she’s leaning toward Obama, but now she knows she’s voting Obama. Why? She can’t tolerate the thought of Palin. Not a big deal in and of itself, but that means the women she plays cards with are talking about Palin. None of them can stand her. OK, they’re in NY and NY goes blue, but it’s a sign of the times, folks. I can feel it.
Please, Joe Biden, don’t go after her too hard. Just let her speak and fall on her own. So much better than you tripping her up.
People are saying it’s who heads the ticket that makes a difference. Not true in this election. Palin gave the campaign a bump and now she’s their roadblock to the White House. I’m eating it up that they thought they duped the voter. But it’s biting them in the ass.
What a great way to end my Saturday. Here’s to a great Saturday night!
Obama/Biden 08
GJ
Great idea about the avery magnets
I used to silkscreen too. As a hobby, mostly, have done a few things to sell. And used to do tee shirts for camps, church groups, etc.
What are you going to print with silkscreen?
Alaskans for Truth rally photos are up and running.
http://www.mamadance.wordpress.com
Friends –
Have you seen this yet? It takes just a minute to read – a heartwarming insight into Obama’s kind nature. The piece is awesome, and the comments truly affirming.
“An Unsung Moment of the Debate”
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/9/27/11751/6583/851/612394
What a great story DeMo. Thanks. A slogan just popped into my head from this –
Palin game McCain a bump – and now she’d giving him a grind!
That unsung moment post about Obama is great – thanks for sharing, Cathy! He is a class act – through and through.
I dont know if this is the correct area to post this…but
I have some major concerns and just wanted to get other folks opinions
Last week I attended a drug court graduation…people are sent to drug rehab rather than prison…anyway, at the graduation they said two prayers, one before and one after the graduation. What concerned me was the prayers were very Christian…Jesus, our Father in Heaven…etc…but this was in family court
Today I went to our County court and found in the waiting area (where you sit after going through the scanner before going into the courtroom) I found a copy of Newsmax on the table, for people to read. The other mags were like family circle etc
Third, a friend of mine just stopped going to her church. she told me two people from her church had sent out emails stating something like a vote for Obama is a vote against GOD. she no longer feels she can attend this church due to this stance
Is it me that is finding junk everywhere that I find offensive…am I being oversensitive or is there a right wing conspiracy at play? Very interested in others thoughts